Hughes "Real Chrysler Camshafts"

[RR3834bbl]

I’ve been doing a lot of research into the dizzying array of new state of the art computer designed camshaft profiles. One of the cam suppliers that has come up on more than one occasion is Hughes Engines, Inc. For years I’ve seen the their advertisements in the back of Mopar magazines touting how their camshafts are “Real Chrysler cams, but I was always a bit apprehensive of installing a cam from a little known speed shop… Well, little known to me that is. And now the suggestion has been made to use a Hughes cam. So I took an on-line field trip to Hughes Engines, Inc., and it appears that they have a decent Mopar specific speed shop where they develop and manufacture a number of go fast goodies just for the Mopar crowd.

So, my questions are: How many of you out there have used one of these cams? Would you do it over again? What was your overall experience with Hughes Engines,

[425W5]

I have used their hyd cams in our circle track motors with real good success and they make a lot of TQ and HP.We won 3 track championships in a row til they got rid of the class(Super Trucks).

[ehostler]

Hughes does not make their own cams. They are contracted out. In any case, it does use the wide lobe with faster ramp rates.

As Hughes and Racer Brown have been catering to the MOPAR world for so long, they would be my recommendation for a cam.

[dust]

Originally Posted by ehostler

Hughes does not make their own cams. They are contracted out. In any case, it does use the wide lobe with faster ramp rates.

As Hughes and Racer Brown have been catering to the MOPAR world for so long, they would be my recommendation for a cam.

Who grinds the Hughes cams?

Seems like the faster ramp rates are the way to go, but what do you mean by 'wide lobe'?

[moraycen]

I put a 578-587 in place of the mopar 590 picked up 2 (count em 2 ) thenths in the 1/8 im very happy wiht it (no other mods)I would have went biger , however pistons would not let me.

[c318cuin]

Most other cam grinders make Chevy width lobes on Mopar cams (.842 chevy vs .904 Mopar). The wider lobe allows for a faster ramp rate due to the pressure is spread over a broader surface area than with Chevy lobes... I have heard the down side is more friction but the difference must be either too small to matter or the increased lift rate just makes that much more power that it over comes the friction increase?!?! Oh well hughes seems like a good group so if i had the moolah I'd prolly have one too but alas i am running a comp cams XE268 soon so wish me luck!

[cageman]

I have a couple cams that I had ground by Ultradyne that were called NF series, they were made for the wider cam spacing and bigger lifter size that Dodge engines have. Most cams are designed off of a chvey lifter size, thus not using the available ramp rate that our lifters can actually utilize. I cant remember any more where the guy who ran Ultradyne went to work for, but he knew what he was doing.

[dgc333]

Crane, Comp and Lunati also make cams that take advatange of the larger mopar lifter.

Racer Brown offers the same lobe grinds on mopar, GM and Ford blanks which suggests to me that they are not taking advantage of the larger mopar lifter.

[nhdriver]

Originally Posted by c318cuin

Most other cam grinders make Chevy width lobes on Mopar cams (.842 chevy vs .904 Mopar). The wider lobe allows for a faster ramp rate due to the pressure is spread over a broader surface area than with Chevy lobes... I have heard the down side is more friction but the difference must be either too small to matter or the increased lift rate just makes that much more power that it over comes the friction increase?!?! Oh well hughes seems like a good group so if i had the moolah I'd prolly have one too but alas i am running a comp cams XE268 soon so wish me luck!

I'll take a little more friction over a wiped cam (a Chevy specialty!) any day!

[jelsr]

Dunno about the other mfg's but Jim at Racer Brown also does mushroom lifter grinds like my STX-60 with a full 1.00" dia. lifter face. (.632" and 271* @ .050) They offer really radical opening and closing rates but at a price. The lobes must be narrowed in order to keep the lobe from contacting the lifter face on the other bank at the same time and spring selection is touchy. I would think a shorter bore center to bore center engine with the correspondingly shorter lifter area would have these same problems even with their smaller dia. lifters.

[dave571]

Originally Posted by dgc333

Crane, Comp and Lunati also make cams that take advatange of the larger mopar lifter.

Racer Brown offers the same lobe grinds on mopar, GM and Ford blanks which suggests to me that they are not taking advantage of the larger mopar lifter.

Racer brown is a one man show. Jim. He talks to you about what cam is best for your application, grinds it personally, then ships it to you. You simply can't get that from a bigger company.

I don't know what he offers in brand X cams, but his mopar ones are definately ground for the mopar lifter.

I have run them in several customer and personal applications with great success. I posted about a Back to back comparison with a similiar comp grind, and it was not much of a comparison at all.

The drawback to Jim is the wait time. He is always weeks behind, at best, months at worst.

As for hughes, I've heard good and bad. There are definately guys who have had sucess with them. BUT they are not more real than any other cam ground for the bigger lifter

[ehostler]

Originally Posted by dgc333

Crane, Comp and Lunati also make cams that take advatange of the larger mopar lifter.

Yes, they do. They are only doing it now for the money. Hughes and Racer Brown were doing it before there was much money to be had in producing a true MOPAR cam.

Originally Posted by dgc333

Racer Brown offers the same lobe grinds on mopar, GM and Ford blanks which suggests to me that they are not taking advantage of the larger mopar lifter.

Wrong. His posted specs appear to be the same. For the MOPAR cam, he does use correct size lobe and faster ramp rates. The ramp rate is one of the specs that he does not list.

[a440plus6®]

Originally Posted by dust

Who grinds the Hughes cams?

Seems like the faster ramp rates are the way to go, but what do you mean by 'wide lobe'?

I beleive it's engle but to lazy to run upstairs and check. I have not used anything but Hughes for prolly 10 years.....never had a failure. I buy the whole kit, cam,lifters springs timing chain set etc and Dave is very knowledgable and will spend the time on the phone discussing your particular application.

[sanborn]

Mopar uses a .904 diameter lifter, GM uses a .842" lifter and Ford uses a .875" lifter. In theory and actual practice, the larger diameter lifter allows for a faster "ramp" on the cam which opens/closes the valve faster than for a smaller diameter lifter.

In reality, a lot of racers(especially limited by class restrictions) have larger lifters installed and cams ground for the larger diameter lifter. Our local race engine shop(in rural Tennessee) has the fixtures to bore GMs to both Ford and Mopar lifter bores.
And, cams are ground every day for GMs and Ford that use Mopar lifter bore sizes. Not every cam manufacturer offers these and some that do don't have them listed in the catalog, but they are ground every day. Comp Cams is a major supplier of flat tappet cams to Nascar Cup engine builders. They are all ground for the larger lifter and are very aggressive profiles. But, the guys that answer the phone on "Cam Help" won't talk to you about these profiles. The Nascar profiles are ground by a different division of Comp Cams. And if you want one of these profiles, you must get to the correct division.

One other thing, subcontracting of cam grinding occurs every day, especially around Memphis. I know some Hughes cams are ground in Memphis. You may order a cam from Lunati but it may be ground by Comp, Ultradyne, or any other of the numerous small cam grinders around Memphis. It's all transmitted by phone lines and the grinders are CNC---no big deal.

I have often thought of enlarging the Mopar lifter bores to 1.000", using the chilled iron lifter used in TF engines and then use mushroom lifter grinds. That would be the ultimate in lifter bore diameter. Used TF engine parts guys have the lifters in buckets. But, we are getting out of the flat tappet business(thankfully).

My spill wasn't exactly on the subject but maybe it added to the knowledge level a little.

[ehostler]

At this point the argument MUST stop! All posts relating to the argument have been deleted.

Stick to the original question or the thread will be closed!

-MOD

[cageman]

Sanborn, I thought the chevs couldnt run the dodge lifter size because the lifter would catch the next lobe and all heck breaks out, or is that the limit. I know their lobes are closer together.

[425W5]

Originally Posted by a440plus6®

I beleive it's engle but to lazy to run upstairs and check. I have not used anything but Hughes for prolly 10 years.....never had a failure. I buy the whole kit, cam,lifters springs timing chain set etc and Dave is very knowledgable and will spend the time on the phone discussing your particular application.

It's Engle cams aout of CA.You can have Engle grind one for you and they will change a 1* out of Hughes Cam and sell it to you direct

[TK]

Yeah, I have used a couple hughes cams, they worked geat, just like ISKY, LUNATI, and others.
Engle makes nice cams.

After dealing with Hughes, I will never again, they were rude, too many times.

[a440plus6®]

Originally Posted by 425W5

It's Engle cams aout of CA.You can have Engle grind one for you and they will change a 1* out of Hughes Cam and sell it to you direct.

Thanks for the tip bud.

[DartGT66]

Today, there are several manufacturers that offer "mopar cams", even competition cams have their extreme energy high lift series hydraulics. When using those cams, you need the other valvetrain parts to be on par with them. The closer to the edge of the lifter you take the lifting process, the moer important it becomes, that your lifter positions and angles in the block are correct. That's why hte chevys may have more problems with the cam wear; all the performance with their lifter diameter are "quick rate" cams. Use a similarily designed cam for a mopar lifter diameter, and it will wear out quicker than a slow ramp cam. Even the old mopar performance cams are relatively quick rate cams, kind of "ford cams". However, I have seen a couple of chevys at the track running decently despite of their small diameter lifters. There shouldn't be any reason why a mopar engine couldn't run the same with a similar cam. Most important in a cam is, that it's the correct size for your combination. No magical "mopar only" things will help, unless the grind fits your combination of parts. And with these quick rate cams, itäs extremely important that you use the recommended other parts in the valve train, springs, retainers, pushrods, rockers all need to do their job better than with a slower rate cam, or the quick rate cams will not perform as expected

[REDNECKMOBILE]

Originally Posted by dodgetruckboy

Yeah, I have used a couple hughes cams, they worked geat, just like ISKY, LUNATI, and others.
Engle makes nice cams.

After dealing with Hughes, I will never again, they were rude, too many times.

I have never bought a Hughes product or service but would not let the rudeness change my doing business with him as long as Hughes applies the same singlemindedness to his work. I found out a long time ago that friendly smiling people are not known for quality work, give me a grump any day to do mine.

[DartGT66]

Except, that it USED TO BE engle cams, now hughes has got new grinds that according to my knowledge are ground by someone else. Engle still has the old "hughes grinds".

[72Challenger]

Originally Posted by DartGT66

No magical "mopar only" things will help, unless the grind fits your combination of parts.

This is the best advice in this thread.

[cageman]

But if there is an advantage there, why not use it. It is hard to beat someone when you have the same as them. Sure I could get a chevy grind, but then I would not be taking full advantage of what I have in front of me.

[sundrop_440]

I have a hughes cam HEH2328, I like it, I switched from Comp cam, it was ok, the thing about the guys at Hughes is they tell you what will work and what won't and if you try to convince them of what they have already tried on other combinations, they aren't going to waste much time with you.

[sundrop_440]

I made a mistake on the cam I have, it's a HEH2832 I got the numbers mixed sorry, anyway I wanted to go bigger but he told me with my current combo(440,2266 pistons-junk low compression need I say more) that I shouldn't go any bigger, because it won't improve until I get my compression up,I trust him and I believe him.

[451Mopar]

I have used the Hughes cams and they are pretty good, and the price is reasonable. The Comp extream hi-lift series is simular, but I think more expensive (for the kit) when I checked.

Any of these high rate of lift cams must use the recommended valve springs, and you have to run oil with ZDDP in it. This has been covered to death lately, but the new "conventional" oils will kill a flat tapped cam.

The only bad thing I have heard about Hughes is their sales people have been rude, but their advice is usually correct.

[George G. Leverette]

I use a Hughes cam and they are adamant about using the correct springs and lifters to get maximun performance. I thought it was sales talk but after replacing the stock 340 cam with the Hughes, idle quality improved, the engine runs smoother at all RPM. I also have a Straight Line Performance (Racer Brown) cam in the 360 car and it was cut specifically for the application. Not much fuss about springs and lifters but the cam is a great improvement over the 508 Mopar POS cam. All areas of performance improved. The next build will have the Comp Cams hydraulic roller lifters and cam.

[345Dart]

Straightline Performance I believe is Scott Brown - nothing to do with Racer Brown at all.

[dave571]

Originally Posted by 345Dart

Straightline Performance I believe is Scott Brown - nothing to do with Racer Brown at all.

Different guy. Scott has a good reputation for custom cams also, and I would not hesitate to try one. More into roller cams, from what I remember.