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#1
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oil ring support rail?
Hey guys. I was originally going to turn my 400 block into a 451 stroker, but in the quest for horsepower i might go bigger. the only thing is that when you go much bigger than a 3.75 stroke, the piston requires an oil support rail. I'm wonder what ya'lls opinion is on oil ring support rails. Are they unreliable? do they have any problems that i might not be aware of? Intended use of the motor is mostly street use and occasional strip use.
also, considering stroker kits (and this may be a dumb question) would an EAGLE kit be much better than a 440source kit? the price difference is pretty much negligible. I'm looking specifically at the 4.15 stroke kit for a final displacement of approx. 498 |
#2
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wow that was way to wordy. ill try again.
do oil ring support rails present a problem on a street driven motor? such as, do they cause any reliability issues? |
#3
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anybody got any info on this?
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#4
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I believe there are people on this site that are running the larger strokers on the street. Maybe they have some insight on this. It may depend on how much street time the car actually sees. I'd recommend giving the folks over @ Muscle Motors a call since they actually build these engines as well as sell the kits for them, and get their 2 cents on it.
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#5
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thanks valiant, thats a good idea. i just checked their website and read about their stroker shortblocks and they said
"These VERY short piston motors are recomended for cars that see limited use such as bracket racing or VERY serious street machines." so i guess they might not be a good idea for a street car |
#6
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That's my thinking on it with such thin ring lands, I can't see it being a very durable set up for street use in the long term. I haven't built/owned one myself, but I think that a stroker such as the 400/474ci engine would probably be the ticket without the piston ring issues. Funny, I was just discussing this topic with a friend this morning. I'm interested in building one myself, but just don't have the extra coin for the rods & pistons for the combo so I'm sticking with a stock stroke 440. If your wanting a big block in an A-body without the extra deck height of the 440, I think this would be a killer engine that would be great for street/strip usage & still be relatively durable & reliable compared to the combos that are near 500ci. The other great thing about the 474 is that the stock cyl head is capable of supporting an engine of this size up to 7k rpm, so no need to buck up for expensive aftermarket heads which is something to consider. A fairly mild 474 should be good for 550-600 HP using the usual stuff like solid/solid roller cams, stock ported big valve heads, single plane intake & large carb, 2" headers etc. So no need for add-ons like turbos, NOS, or blowers which is nice.
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#7
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i was considering the 474 but to get one without the oil ring rail it has to have a shorter rod and that means a heavier piston. im wondering if the extra 20 cubes (over a 451 stroker) are worth the heavier piston. any thoughts valiant?
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#8
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Are you sure that the pistons for the 474" require them? This engine uses the BB Chevy style rod. Supposedly the bobweight of the rotating ass'y is lighter than the stock 340. Quick revving, big-inch low deck stroker sounds good to me! The 451 really isn't any bigger than a stock stroke 440- (11ci), the benefit is really a shorter deck for better clearance & a slightly lighter piston. Still, you will end up paying more for the additional machine work necessary to fit the 440 crank into the 400 block, so why not build the bigger engine that will make more power and still be externally the same size if you have the extra coin for the build? Again, I'd give Muscle Motors or 440 Source a call & get the lowdown on what you're looking at before you make a decision.
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#9
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I wouldn't use them in a street engine, I would rahter build a 4.25" stroke with 6.535" rods, they can do without the rings in the pin hole. We have had a 4.15" stroke 400 where the ring in hte pin hole caused a problem; some trash from the engine got to the oil ring groove through thr pin hole, and locked the oil rings in one cylinder. It didn't cause an engine failure or anything like that, but the loss of oil control and the resulting "wet" chamber doesn't do any good for power and detonation resistance. I would use them only in engines that will gete opened and checked frequently, not in a true street engine.
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