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  #1  
Old 07-10-2012, 10:58 PM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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Help 360 Magnum Weight Location

Hi guys, not long ago I ordered a P5249843 magnum 360 balance weight AND positioning template package from the The Moparts Connection. I told Todd that I needed the info on where to put the weights, as without it, they wouldn't do me a darn bit of good. He mentioned that they might not come with the instructions anymore, and I repeated that without it, they wouldn't do me a darn bit of good. So he when and checked, and said yea they should. Well they made it here today, and guess what? Yep no instructions. At this point I could go off on a rant, but instead I'll just ask to see if anyone here knows where they go? I've done searches, and no luck. What do these people think that the person ordering the part should just be born with the information or what?! I've read the 360 Magnum flywheel thread, but it doesn't deal with adding weight, just how much to remove. I would guess that adding weight would go on the opposite side, but how far out do I need to add these two weights? What would be really nice is if one of you just might have the diagram that was suppose to come with my set, and scan and post the info here pretty please?!
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  #2  
Old 07-11-2012, 11:29 AM
440roadrunner 440roadrunner is offline
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In my opinion, using these weights is flawed, bad logic. "You" and by that, I mean "most of us who don't have engine balancing facilities" cannot guarantee that these weights will ACTUALLY put things "in balance."

Do yourself a favor. Spend a little money and buy a B&M flex plate. Get the right on, LAs and Magnums are both external, but both are differently balanced.

The advantage to that flex plate is

It's balanced correctly

You don't risk effin' up your converter

If you later decide to go 318/340 you don't have to turn around and grind on the converter "again"
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  #3  
Old 07-11-2012, 11:17 PM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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I don't have the money to spend on a part, that while very nice, isn't necessary. Since I can still weld, it's not a big deal to move or transfer the weights if need be. What ever happened to the old way of doing something by building it, rather than buying it and bolting it on? Come on guys, someone here should know where the weights go by simply having done it themselves! Or at least have the instructions that the factory in it's own lack of wisdom, no longer offers with the part! What they have done to you is just like having your first child, "Here ya go Mr. and Mrs. XYZ, have fun with that"! You have a basic idea of what needs to be done, but you have to figure it out on your own because there's NO INSTRUCTIONS! Good job idiots!!!!!!! I have the flexplate (It's a 94' model), that came with the motor, and I'd like to add the weights to it, instead of buying one. I really don't have the money, I'm a cancer patient living off $700.00 a month. I have to get by as cheap as possible! Sorry for the rant, but the more I think about it, the more pissed off I get!
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Old 07-12-2012, 07:26 AM
chirorod chirorod is offline
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If you have a lathe, I am guessing that you could rig a mount for the convertor and balance it that way. But that would not balance the motor. I believe that the 360 is balanced by weight on the convertor, rather than by removing weight on the crank. If the motor is not already assembled, you could take the crank to a shop and have it balanced or balance it yourself on a set of v blocks, then balance the convertor on the lathe. I would think that the reason for not including instructions is that balancing is a skill usually done in a shop. There is a lot more to balancing than can be diagrammed in a simple set of instructions. Of course, you didn't need this to be added to your grief, but the sunny side might be learning a whole new set of skills.
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  #5  
Old 07-12-2012, 09:55 AM
440roadrunner 440roadrunner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chirorod View Post
If you have a lathe, I am guessing that you could rig a mount for the convertor and balance it that way. But that would not balance the motor..
You cannot do that. The converter is allegedly IN balance now, with no weights, being set up for an "internal balance" engine. The purpose of the weights is to balance the engine "overall" as the engine itself is OUT of balance---"external balance"

I hate to sound harsh, but your lack of money does not justify an inferior solution. Engine balance is IMPORTANT. It's not just whether an engine vibrates and shakes. It's whether the thing will hang together very long. It's how broken parts happen.
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  #6  
Old 07-12-2012, 02:21 PM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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How is following what the factory does a inferior solution? I'm not building a Nascar engine that will need perfect balance to run at 10,000 RPM. I really doubt I'll take it pass 5,500. Does not the factory weld the weights to the converter(early) and the flexplate (96' on up)? If not please let me know what they did do. I'm not trying to pick a fight, and I realize the factory balance might not be spot on, but it was close enough for 1000's of engines, and will be close enough for me! All I'm trying to do is just find out where the factory put the weights in relation to the crankshaft, why is finding that out so darn hard? If someone has a 360 Magnum flexplate with the weights or the early set up, all I need is a picture and a measurement. I think I could even use a picture of a B&M flex plate with a measurement of the center of the side that doesn't have the big hole. From what I've seen, B&M removes matierial to make one side heavier than the other. For all I know the factory might have done the same thing with the 96' and up flexplates as I've never seen one. The engine has been built for a while, and all I need is to find out where the weights need to go!(Beats his head against brick wall)
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  #7  
Old 07-12-2012, 02:27 PM
John Kunkel John Kunkel is offline
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I wouldn't characterize the solution as "inferior", after all the factory sent tens of thousands of them out the door. The key is proper weight and proper location. My converter shop removes the weight from all incoming cores and adds the weight as needed for each application.

"Proper balance" is a relative term, the factory only average balanced entire engines and added a calculated weight to the balancer and converter and there's no epidemic of balance-related failures.

Since this application is a '94 you could use the weighted flexplate from a '96 or later 360 Magnum and just elongate the one drive bolt hole that is located differently....these should be less expensive in a wrecking yard.
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  #8  
Old 07-12-2012, 03:22 PM
Dr. Righteous Dr. Righteous is offline
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I always found the BEST and easiest solution for dealing with externally balanced engines was to run the B&M flexplate for that engine. Then you can run a regular unbalanced converter, or just grind the weights of of it. Done this on 360s and 400s.
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  #9  
Old 07-12-2012, 05:11 PM
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Ray Bell Ray Bell is offline
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Could you perhaps go to a wrecking yard and look around what there is there?

Or a transmission rebuilder?
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  #10  
Old 07-13-2012, 07:56 AM
340_GTS 340_GTS is offline
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I cannot believe that nobody has the diagram that supposedly comes (came?) with the weights. If you go to purchase these weights today on-line at a multitude of retailers, the description always says that that they come with instructions. Nobody kept them? I'd be frustrated too David!
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  #11  
Old 07-13-2012, 08:49 PM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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Yea, it's a real bumber. I have no plans on buying another flexplate. I know that the B&M works, but I am fighting cancer, and don't have a penny to spare. I really wish people would just understand that I'm trying to build this car on a wish budget, as in I wish I could buy this or that. I'm really surprised that no one so far has the info on where to put the weights. I know where I'd like to put them!
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  #12  
Old 07-13-2012, 11:43 PM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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Well I think I've found it. This is what I've found....
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 001.jpg (65.6 KB, 24 views)
File Type: jpg 002.jpg (77.9 KB, 24 views)
File Type: jpg 004.jpg (30.4 KB, 24 views)
File Type: jpg 006.jpg (27.6 KB, 23 views)
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  #13  
Old 07-14-2012, 12:00 AM
RacerHog RacerHog is offline
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That be the one......

I'm trying to remember.... But I think the instructions ether come with the converter or the weight kit when you buy it... I remember having to buy some extra stuff as per the instruction sent with the crate motor...
Glad you found them....I still have mine.....

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  #14  
Old 07-14-2012, 12:03 AM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Kunkel View Post
Since this application is a '94 you could use the weighted flexplate from a '96 or later 360 Magnum and just elongate the one drive bolt hole that is located differently....these should be less expensive in a wrecking yard.
If I hadn't already bought the weights which are worth less than a $1, which I have a big issue with paying 33 bucks for with no instructions! With the instructions then yea, that's fair, but with two weights and nothing but but an excuse, that's a Fing rip off!

Anyway it's a good idea-Thanks
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  #15  
Old 07-14-2012, 12:06 AM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RacerHog View Post
That be the one......Glad you found them....
Me too! That you for the confirmation!
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  #16  
Old 07-14-2012, 03:44 AM
340_GTS 340_GTS is offline
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That sure looks like it. I remember seeing that before, like 30 years ago! Good luck.
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  #17  
Old 07-14-2012, 03:50 PM
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Congratulations, David, that should make it all possible for you...
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  #18  
Old 07-14-2012, 05:47 PM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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Thanks guys
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Old 07-14-2012, 08:06 PM
dodger1 dodger1 is offline
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Before you get the welder running, didn't you say you had a 94 Magnum 360 (5.9)? I thought the external balance factor changed with the Magnum engines. The info you have is for LA 360 only. Mr. Kunkel will correct me if I'm wrong, (I hope)
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Old 07-15-2012, 12:27 PM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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I ordered the Magnum weights which I do plan on checking their weight on a postal scale. Is the weight placement in a different location? I sure hope not, because if they are in a different location, I'm right back to where I started! (Go to jail, go straight to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200.00 dollars!)
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  #21  
Old 07-15-2012, 03:06 PM
John Kunkel John Kunkel is offline
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Without an exact template for the weight you have it's still a guessing game. Even if you know the weigh of what you have you don't know the inch-ounce figure for the 360 Magnum (how far from center to locate it), the diagrams posted are only relative to the 360LA....this was discussed in the other thread.

The problem arises from different locations the factory installed the weights, the location depends on the diameter of the converter; since the Magnum converters never had a drain plug and only come in the 10 3/4" diameter the 360LA info is irrevevant.
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  #22  
Old 07-15-2012, 11:04 PM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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Yes and no. They might not have a drain plug, but the early Magnum's did have a offset converter lug, just like the LA. So I would still have a point of reference. Of course if any one here just happens to have a B&M flexplate for a 360 Magnum sitting around, and where to say, take a close up picture, that would help a hole lot! When I'm in Albuquerque, I'll see if the local tranny supplier happens to have a 360 Magnum converter laying around. If they do, I'll match up my flexplate to it, and mark where(and the size/type of) the weights need to go on the flexplate. I don't know what else to do at this point.
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Old 07-16-2012, 01:37 PM
dodger1 dodger1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beleneagle View Post
When I'm in Albuquerque, I'll see if the local tranny supplier happens to have a 360 Magnum converter laying around. If they do, I'll match up my flexplate to it, and mark where(and the size/type of) the weights need to go on the flexplate. I don't know what else to do at this point.
Another possible source would be a shop that can balance Chrysler rotating assy.s. They should have weighted flexplates to accommodate externally-balanced engines.
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Old 07-17-2012, 11:25 AM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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There's only two big Machine shops left in Albuquerque, and they just use the B&M. However, someone on another forum has the Magnum instructions and is sending them to me. That's good too, as the Javelin's engine bay is getting closer to being done.
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:05 AM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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I'm afraid you'll have to send me a pm to get the proper instructions for a Magnum 360 as the file is too big and it's a pdf so I can't re-size it, but here's mine modified flexplate:

Here is the factory one piece which is about half as thick as the two piece....
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  #26  
Old 07-25-2012, 01:59 PM
John Kunkel John Kunkel is offline
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The important thing that beleneagle's quest revealed is the actual out-of-balance weight spec for the Magnum 360 (stated in the instruction text)...it's 14 in. oz.
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  #27  
Old 07-29-2012, 01:33 PM
beleneagle beleneagle is offline
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Correct, thanks John!
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