Does your local track screw Mopars?

[Stoga]

Pardon me for the usage of the word screw here in this fashion, but after what I saw last weekend at my local track, it just irritated me to pieces. I was watching the street stock qualifiers, top 5 cars go to the feature. First qualfier, saw a guy in a Ford hit a Camaro and spin him out, race stops, Ford goes to the back of the pack and misses the feature. I thought it was only fair, come to the 2nd qualifier, a fellow in a Plymouth Volare is looking real good, and running 2nd when a fellow in a Camaro takes him out the same way, guess who goes to the back of the pack and misses the feature? That right, the Mopar! I was so mad, I could spit fire. I was by myself, so I just left the track and said heck with them, I'll spend my money elsewhere. I doubt it will make much difference to that track, but I do find their attitude way to common. Do you Mopar roundy round racers have this problem much? I've considered building a stocker, but between the exclusionary rules, around here street stock means camaro, while econo means Ford Pinto/Mustang. No cars with aluminum heads allowed , so much for Mopar 2.2 and 2.0's unless you want to race a Simca, you'll have fun finding parts though. Is this typical? Local racing seems like the deck is stacked against you around here, can a Mopar round track racer get a fair shake anywhere?

[Glen440]

I have a good one for you. A track this year has purposely put extra restrictions on Mopar to slow them down. Mopar has to be 100 pounds heavier than ford and chev. Mopars have to use the 1.88 intake valve. Everyone else can use 2.02's. I hear it is because some Mopars kicked but at that track last year. Its bad enough when out of the 150 cars at the track there is maybe 5 Mopars.
Up here you have a 360 cube limit. I guess if a chev doesn't win you have to bend the rules for it. Next I guess they'll have to ban Mopar if they still win.

[340king]

They are just a prejudiced in Wissota country also. I was sent to the back of the pack last year when a bowtie bozo drilled me in the drivers door coming off of turn two. He had driven into the infield and caught a good bite coming off the tacky dirt there. I had just checked up for the guy infornt of me and he practically drove right through me. They put me in the back.

The best example of a Chevy rule is that they allow the cars to run 410 cubic inches. Another one is the 362 cubic inch limit. It allows the use of a stroker engine combo, but eliminates any overboring of a 360 Mopar. They actually outlawed a guy after winning the modified points championship three or four years in a row with a big block Mopar. They put the 410 cubic inch rule into effect.

In the Super Stock class you must run 40 lbs of wieght in front of the mid plate if you run a 360 Mopar. They limit the cars to .040" over with no strokers allowed.

[sanborn]

We have fought this problem for years. Of course the rules are written around Chevrolet engines, that's 95% of the competition. Ford engine combinations are actually very close to Chevrolet. Really, Mopar combinations are the oddball. So, you must find ways around the rules.

We have found most tracks want Mopars because it puts more fans in the stands. But don't expect an advantage because 95% are GM. Most track owners/tech officials don't know anything about Mopars. Educate them, explain what the bore/stroke combinations are, what your options are. Most will cut some slack. Have your facts together, get the Mopar engine books, show the track owners what is in WRITING. If you need info about W2 or other heads call Mopar Techline and have them FAX you the info. They will do it.

It sure worked for our local tracks. Mopars are now probably 15-20% especially in the stock and hobby classes V8 classes.

[Jesse Lackman]

Is that why Leo is running a SB Chevy now?



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[cageman]

I dont know the IMCA rules for motors but Leo does race that class along with Wissota. In the lower classes mopar gets away with more because it is chevy based. I get crap about my center dump exhaust manifolds and the chevy guys cant run them along with angle plug heads. The chevy guys have a plentiful aftermarket availability that I dont have.

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DIRT is for racing... asphalt's for getting there!

[29street]

Originally posted by Stoga:
Pardon me for the usage of the word screw here in this fashion, but after what I saw last weekend at my local track, it just irritated me to pieces. I was watching the street stock qualifiers, top 5 cars go to the feature. First qualfier, saw a guy in a Ford hit a Camaro and spin him out, race stops, Ford goes to the back of the pack and misses the feature. I thought it was only fair, come to the 2nd qualifier, a fellow in a Plymouth Volare is looking real good, and running 2nd when a fellow in a Camaro takes him out the same way, guess who goes to the back of the pack and misses the feature? That right, the Mopar! I was so mad, I could spit fire. I was by myself, so I just left the track and said heck with them, I'll spend my money elsewhere. I doubt it will make much difference to that track, but I do find their attitude way to common. Do you Mopar roundy round racers have this problem much? I've considered building a stocker, but between the exclusionary rules, around here street stock means camaro, while econo means Ford Pinto/Mustang. No cars with aluminum heads allowed , so much for Mopar 2.2 and 2.0's unless you want to race a Simca, you'll have fun finding parts though. Is this typical? Local racing seems like the deck is stacked against you around here, can a Mopar round track racer get a fair shake anywhere?

This is my 3rd yr. of dirt racing a 340 Dart.First yr. all they did was laugh and say torsion bars will never work.2nd yr. they wanted me to weld the torsion bar adjusters so I wouldnt have an advantage over the camraroos.I never did,argueing it came that way stock.Last yr. we had a rules meeting where they were going to raise cid limit from 360 to 362 so a .060 over 350 cheevy would be legal.I suggested to at least raise it to 363cid so I could run a .020over 360.All racers and track officials voted me out.They also told me to get rid of the angle plug heads or dont come back.My rods where too long,my stock aluminum water pump brought them much grief.They finally allowed the stock motor,but no 363cid.If I was even around a wreck last yr. they sent me to the rear.Still got three feature wins and finished 5th in the points,despite the unfair treatment.This yr. they have left me alone.I have passed every p&g test and all teardowns for the past 3yrs.To let some of the cheevys pass the p&g test they were allowed to just bump the motor over a couple of times!
Just got my first feature win of this yr.June 3rd,I'm leading the points race by over 150points.Guess if you endure enough bull,they will eventually leave you alone.It worked for me.

[sanborn]

Hang tough, 29Street. When the track owners realize you are bringing in new fans to the stands, they will listen to you better. By the way, we ran at Jackson last year. I like the track.

[roodypoo]

yes with the new imca rules leo switched to small block chevy.

[roodypoo]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by roodypoo:
[B]yes with the new imca rules leo switched to small block chevy. plus i think he got sick off everbody trying to screw with him and his dodge, up here they went to great extent to screw with the high flying 8-ball back in the day, in fact in jamestown nd which has to be one of the fastest quarter miles in the country they put tires out half way on the racing line so he couldn't go down low.

[cageman]

Ive been to Jtown every year for past 6 years and I have never seen them put out tires, I have seen them take that chevy truck and water alot before a race down low. but if your name is not Correl or gumke you didnt get your way. I once raced in Jtown and I started in the 20th spot of the feature and I passed the first place guy in the last corner and I won. The next week I got there later than usual and they said that I missed the draw. As I drive through the gate, the car behind me that was a local car got to draw and he started on the front row. I ended up winning again that night and they were mad. At the stampede they took me out the first lap of the feature and I did not finish. I would have been up front and they knew it!

[roodypoo]

obviously you must not have gone there very often then because they did it, i have gone there every saturday since i was a little kid and seen it with my own eyes, so don't tell me that it didn't happen.

Originally posted by cageman:
Ive been to Jtown every year for past 6 years and I have never seen them put out tires, I have seen them take that chevy truck and water alot before a race down low. but if your name is not Correl or gumke you didnt get your way. I once raced in Jtown and I started in the 20th spot of the feature and I passed the first place guy in the last corner and I won. The next week I got there later than usual and they said that I missed the draw. As I drive through the gate, the car behind me that was a local car got to draw and he started on the front row. I ended up winning again that night and they were mad. At the stampede they took me out the first lap of the feature and I did not finish. I would have been up front and they knew it!

[cageman]

You are probably right with the tires but like you said you have been there every saturday and I have only been there twice this year. I was crashed out both times. I go to underwood on saturdays. I see on the kbmr site that you are a big IMCA fan LOL! they deleted the ones about the stock cars that was getting to be a good one to read until they deleated it.

[roodypoo]

Yeah i am a huge fan of imca racing, its a hoot. i just think it is really sad that we don't ever get any of the good racers from the east out here anymore, hopefully your pops comes threw for next years tour, he said that they had some ideas to get them hear right.

Originally posted by cageman:
You are probably right with the tires but like you said you have been there every saturday and I have only been there twice this year. I was crashed out both times. I go to underwood on saturdays. I see on the kbmr site that you are a big IMCA fan LOL! they deleted the ones about the stock cars that was getting to be a good one to read until they deleated it.

[JOHN SHERRED]

mopar gets screwed at abilene speedway on 12 aug in pure stock they give the second place chevy a trip around the track with the checkered and show the first place mopar the way to the pits

[340king]

I just heard about this one today. At Oklahoma State Fair Speedway they run a class called Pro-stock. They had a couple of Dodges running up front. They were torn down and found to have aftermarket cranks in them. They were DQ'ed.

The following week they protested the top 5 GM cars. Two were found to be completely within the rules, but the other three were running splayed maincaps. After some discussion, they were determined to be legal. I got this second hand from a friend in OK. I have talked to the engine builder in OKC. He told me that they were in deed running aftermarket cranks, because they were breaking the stock cast 360 cranks. The replacements were the same weight as the stock cranks.

It will be interesting to see what develops with the engine I just built. It is a Magnum headed 360. It features adjustable shaft rockers. The rules say that you must run stock stamped steel rockers. I called the head tech man prior to building the engine and he said that the setup would be legal if I used stock rockers. We will see.

[RamHead]

340, when you say ajustable shaft rockers, are you talking ajustable push rods? Are is there something I should KNOW!
RamHead

[9dodge]

I'm gonna jump in on this topic.
At first I thought that my local track, screwed me, BUT, now I bring alot of fans out to the races. The fans LOVE to root for the underdog, and thats me in a Dodge. So now I feel I get special privliges.

Michael

[AVENGER29]

LIKE MOST,IM SURE, WHEN I SHOWED UP WITH A DODGE PRODUCT AT MY LOCAL TRACK,THE FIRST COMMENTS MADE,RIGHT AFTER THEY STOPPED LAUGHING SO HARD WAS" YOU'LL NEVER MAKE A TORSION BAR CAR GO AROUND A TRACK", EVEN THOUGHT THIS SEASON HAS NOT BEEN VERY GOOD FOR NO FAULT OF OUR OWN.
OUR FIRST SEASON RESULTED IN 2 HEAT RACE WIN,2 FEATURE WIN,AND A ROOKIE OF THE YEAR,
THIS YEAR UNFORTUNATELY HAS NOT BEEN KIND,AN EXPLODED ENGINE,AND AN INABILITY TO STAY OUT OF OTHER PEOPLES MISFORTUNE,SEEM LIKE WE HAVE BEEN INVOLVED IN SOMEONE ELSE WRECK ALMOST EVERY NIGHT.HOWEVER WE HAVE EARN A GREAT DEAL OF RESPECT FROM OUR PEERS,WHOM ARE ALL BUT ONE DRIVING GM PRODUCTS. THERE IS ANOTHER FOOL OUT THERE RACING A BLUE OVAL.
EARLY THIS SEASON AFTER QUALIFYING ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE POLE,WE WERE INVOLVED IN A MISAPT ON FIRST LAP,WENT TO THE PIT TO CHANGE A FLAT,THEY HELD THE YELLOW AND ALLOWED US TO GO BACK TO STARTING POSITION.HOWEVER WE HAVE NOT BEEN SO LUCKY ON THE ROAD,WE RACE SHADYOAKS SPEEDWAY IN GOLIAD TEXAS,FEW WEEKS AGO,FIRST THEY FORCE US TO RACE IN PRO-STOCK,BECAUSE OF OUR FACTORY WEIGHT JACKS AGAINST CARS SPORTING SMILEY CHASSIS AND WRINKLE WALL TIRES,THEN THEY DQ MY A$#%#&$ AFTER I WAS INVOLVED IN A MINOR WRECK THAT I HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH, THEY SENT ME TO THE BACK IN THE FEATURE,ON SMALL SPEC TIRES STARTED 19TH AND FINISH 7TH,HAD THEY ALLOWED ME TO RUN IN MY OWN CLASS,I WOULD HAVE DOMIBATED WITHOUT QUESTION,WE WERE NEARLY HALF A SECOND FASTER A LAP THEN THE FASTEST CAR IN LATE MODEL STOCK.TO TOP IT ALL OFF,THEY REFUSE TO PAY MY POSITION AND BASICALLY TOLD ME NOT TO COME BACK.WHICH IS OK,A IMCA MOD IS IN OUR FUTURE,WE ARE SLIGHTLY BULL HEADED AND WILL GO BACK BUT IN A CAR THAT RUNS ON A SET OF NATIONAL RULES NOT SOME DIRTY LITTLE TRACK IN TEXAS,LIKE GOLIAD!!!! WE HAVE PROVEN THAT OUR ENGINE PROGRAMS MAKES REAL HP.AND ON MOST GIVEN NIGHT I CAN DRIVE LIKE HELL,SO WILL SEE WHO LAUGH LAST...

[340king]

Ramhead, the heads are screw in studs from the factory. We created a support stand that attaches to the head via the screw in stud holes. This allows us to run the stock 273 style adjustable rocker arms on a stud mount head. The pieces are CNC machined and look real nice. The jury is still out as to whether we made them beefy enough or not. The rules require stock un modified rockers, but specifically states that poly locks are allowed as are screw in studs and guide plates. Everything the bowtie boys need, but they have to run stock rockers. Lots of broken parts at the end of each feature. We wanted to avoid that and opted for the shaft rockers.

As for your venture into IMCA mods Avenger, that is a pretty daunting task. I have an IMCA/Wissota mod. In your neck of the woods, a small displacement, low rotating weight/mass engine should work well. The 360's are the cheapest and heaviest rotating assembly, the 340's are awesome but rare, and the 318's are expensive. If you are interested, I will detail everything that has and hasn't worked for me, e-mail me and let me know. P.S. I helped a friend who raced in OK, AK, TX, KS and MO running a Mopar powered IMCA mod.

[RamHead]

340 KING,
I was aware of the 273 set up. What threw me was the adjustable shaft. We are allowed to run the roller rockers, which is a definite improvement over shiming rocker shafts. If the avenger is not interested in your trial/errors. I AM!


RamHead

[AVENGER29]

340 king, not sure how to email from this posting,very interested in what works and doesnt,have a pile of scrap pieces to prove that!!!!!
please post or email me at racemethan@aol.com
or lvigneault@haciendaford.com
thanks appreciate all the help.
luke

[AVENGER29]

oh by the way dont hold the ford thing against me it pays the bills.lol
luke