Should I build hemi or wedge?

[Mr. Trans Am]

Getting interested in building motor for my '69 Runner. Thinking of building a hemi. Wedge heads do good but have the shops got the hemi down now since it has been back in full force for a few years now? Might build a bad ass 440 for my Challenger while I consider this. I saw there is a new kit out w/ some tough mounts to drop hemi in now, makes it even more tempting.

[DartGT66]

Depends on what you want. If you want looks and cost is no pbject, then it's definitely a Hemi.

[Mr. Trans Am]

I just wonder how the Hemi heads flow vs say a set of new edelbrock or indy heads on a street app. I want violent power for "cruising". Want to run like 3.23 or so for highway use but strip action will happen. Need a lot of torque. Plug changes are a plus for hemi, I'm tired of crawling all over to get to plugs, damn headers in the way. Hemi would be nice but a wedge would be cheaper, leaving more coin for heads.

[Mills]

I would stay away from the HEMI. You could build 2 or 3 very good 440's for the price of one HEMI. Also, these days, more and more companies are putting more delevopment into the MOPAR wedge engine.

If money is no option, and it will see more strip then street, go with the HEMI. I would still stay away from that dual 4bbl setup.

440 weighs less.

You can tell the Chevy and Ford guys it's a 383 and they would never know the difference!

When you pop the hood, and ANYONE sees those spark plug wires coming through the valve covers, they know it's a HEMI and to stay away. I would rather walk soft, and carry a big stick.

[Mr. Trans Am]

Good point but I don't pop my hood for the losers around here anyway. I've had a "318" Challenger for years now and that is w/ a R/T badge on the front LOL. "That 318 sounds good, why don't you put a 440 in it? I hear they run good." Me- " That's a good idea, I'll have to look into it." LOL

But really, which heads are better now? Do the wedge heads have a low RPM advantage over hemi or is it close and then the hemi stomps a mudhole up high so it would be no contest. Keep in mind I would ante up for a good aluminum set for both.

[Maxwedge]

A new stage V head(check out www.stageV.com) will double the flow numbers from a Eldelbrock Headed 440..easy
If you got the dough..then Build the Hemi, it will be worth 3x a 440 in sight and sound alone..IMHO
MW

[zenboy]

I look at it this way, because I've been having some similar questions flowing through my little brain. If I were really looking for something to crush guts with, I'd build the Hemi. There's enough legendary advice and brainpower applied to them, that with a little thought, you can build something truly magnificent. A 440, I mean, that's nice. It's a great engine. There are some good go-fast parts and tricks to make a mean 440. But damn, a HEMI. You can get that sort of thing tattoed on your ass and noone will laugh at you about it. If I had endless resources, I'd be all about a Hemi, with Stage V heads, And really, if you're gonna go Hemi, why not go blown. A fat, angular piece of hardware sticking through your hood, making that "wheeeeee" noise. Sweet stuff. But another idea, which isn't all that expensive, is the "early" hemi blocks/kits that are around these days. You could do something really unique there.

Z

[one bad dakota]

I to am trying to decide what motor to build. I've been told that once you start getting into big CI motors that the cost difference is not that much. I've also heard that even though the hemi has more going for it(theoretically), the wedge has more R&D into it. I have a lot of unaswered questions as well. Which design is more durable? Does the complexity of the hemi valvetrain make it a liability? Its piston configuration pose problems? I'd rather go for the hemi,but I frankly don't know a lot about it.
Tom

[Maxwedge]

Go to the Drag racing forum and ask your question in the "Hemis in NHRA" Thread..there are a few guys there with Years of experience and they should be able to help you descide.
and no they dont read threads outside of the one I mentioned often...you gotta go to them..
MW

[DartMan360]

Personaly I think nothing compars when you open the hood and everyone sees that hemi sitting in their. Its amazing how guys act when they see one. Hemis will also keep their value if it is a real hemi. I dont belive in those conversion. How can you lie to your self that your hemi just isnt a real hemi? Sure it might look like one and everyone else might think it is one but deep down i couldnt do it. Whatever you do, do NOT go through Mopar. Their hemi crates are junk. Last week at the world nats a guy bought one. They were un-loading it into his van off of the Mopar trailer. I caught him just in time to talk to him. Next thing I know they are taking it back out and the Mopar "rep" wanted to argue with me about all of the problems that they have had with them leading up to the recalls. Larry Sheapred builds a real nice 100% street able hemi crate for 11,000. Between him and his dad Pappy they got the hole hemi down pat. His crate is 550hp with a true 10-1compression ratio. I talked to him last week and i think it is taking him about 15 weeks to crank one out but it is worth the money and wait. Larry does exclent work and has learned only from the best. Let me know if you want his number.

[Jims451]

The Hemi has the reputation and visual appeal.
Generally the Hemi Heads will flow more CFM.
The Hemi will Cost More.

Besides the cost, The Hemi heads really are designed for high RPM power. They have large ports and flow a bunch, but in a mild street engine you probbly won't be taking advantage of the High RPM airflow, and the large ports may cause air/fuel mixture problems at lower RPMs.
Things that will help make the Hemi more streetable are:
More Displacement, A 572 CID Hemi would be cool.
Or High stall converter / gear.
Or More Compression will help port velocity, but may limit pump gas useage.
Or Fuel injection, This could get expensive...

An alternative for a cool looking street engine would be a big block 6-pack (Koller Dodge has complete setup for about $1,890?) This could be a 440 or maybe a stroker engine.

[5th_Ave_Sleeper]

HEMI DUDE!

[Christopher]

Go with the wedge.The new E-brock heads are very good,and you can build a nice 440 that can pull a 3.23 gear.What I'd do is use the money that you'd end up spending on a Hemi,and upgrade to a 5 or 6 speed manual trans.This way you can use a 3.23 or higher gear,with say a 3.90 1st in the trans and still get power and economy.Plus you'll be able to run high top end speed as well.

[Jims451]

Here is another way to decide:
Under 550 HP go with the wedge, it's less expensive and theoretically should have more torque (assuming both engines are built with the same cam/compression, etc.)
In the 550 - 650+ HP range The cost difference will be minimized, but the hemi may still be slightly more expensive depending on how the engines are built.
If your looking for over 700+ HP, there probbly won't be much of a cost difference as with either setup you should get an aftermarket block (cross bolted?) and you would probbly be using expensive big port wedge or Hemi heads, so there probbly is not much difference in cost or port volume.

[kingjr]

We are putting a recipe together right now for a Donovan racing block(aluminum) hemi that is 100% streetable. It will be 9.5:1 comp and should come in at 550hp. The only drawback to the hemi was the weight of the valve train. I think barton has that figured out. For my car, 71 challenger R/T, even as a clone, every dollar I spend building a hemi will be worth 2 when I'm done! Doubt I'll want to sell it though! Keep us posted on what you decide. <><

[kamstra]

the new Big Block Edelbrock heads angle the spark plugs. This should make spark plug removal much easier with headers. I agree that the stock heads with headers make plug removal a chore. I can send a picture if you want of the 440 with edelbrock heads. Out of the box, the eddy heads flow well. You can port for more flow as required.

Rob

[PRO]

Hemi,Dick Landy built a 750 hp pump gas 528 hemi......or a Big headed wedge with a 250 shot of N2o,your choice........PRO.....

[curious]

definetly.................wedge!
whoa be that shocked the hell outta you. leave the hemis to the strip only dudes and go with a cheaper more dependable wedge. even from the factory the hemi was never desigened to run on the street. not recommended for any driving under 2500rpm. how much positive affect do you think stage 5 heads give to low end??? i just read a reprint of all the maintanence that was supposed to be done to the hemis originally let loose on the street. c'mon get real! practically once a week over hual (not really but a lot of maintenace)

[Mr. Trans Am]

Well sounds like most like the wedge. I have wonder about the low end driveablity of hemi but I will likely go fuelie so that may be negated somewhat. I noticed that one of you is buiding a 9.5 to 1 hemi- I thought that hemi heads could stand around 11 to 1 on pump gas especially with aluminum. I remember reading that a few years ago in a mopar mag.
Barton has a low friction setup for the hemi valvetrain but it's like 3,500 - not too high but enough it may have to wait for awhile.

I think I will just build a good 440 for my challenger(stroker maybe) and see how it does. I just read the shootout in pop hot rodding and one kicked everybody's ass big time. But for now the 'Runner isn't going anyplace(20 miles in 5 years) so it can wait some more.

Also, we haven't talked about chassis requirements- I like 1/4 racing but I don't want to cut for tubs, don't want really to climb through bars all the time so it may not pay for me to build a ground thumper and then not be able to run it.

[Maxwedge]

not for under 2500 rpms,, WHAT????who ever said that and where??the Stock Hemi and the stock 440 had about the same torque peak and at about the same RPM. The Hemi just put down more HP...
If money is a issue then dont get the hemi, a 600hp hemi will cost you about 2x what a 440 will. I think of it this way, you get so few chances in life to do something truely special. If your gonna do it do it BIG. When your 80 and rocking in your chair, the big ol smile will be worth it...
My .02
MW

[Mr. Trans Am]

Hemi would mark one of the list of things to do in life that's for sure. As would living in RB,Ca like you. I worked out there for about a month and it was just plain awesome.

[Maxwedge]

If you ment Ca as in California...yeah, youd be AMAZED at what people drive daily here. 2 of the stranges(and Im only going mopars here) one dude drives one of 3 dodge speedsters to work everyday..its all original, manually adjusted spark, manual breaks.. the whole 9 yards of o;ld car freakyness. nAnother guy found a PERFECT 59 Plymouth Wagon, old flathead 6..he drives the big Orange and cream beast alot, used to be everyday...
Just cool sh!t running on the streets...
MW

[Mr. Trans Am]

Yeah I wasn't even out much and saw some neat stuff. I really liked the weather. Renodo Beach was a nice part of town.

[Maxwedge]

the weather kicks @$$..sunny and 70 all year...bhut buying a House is not in the equation.. And even if it was a POS house costs around 400K...back home(Indiana) that would buy, well basically the whitehouse with attached Dragstrip and 24 car garage....
Pay one way, pay another...oh well, Lots of Eye candie of the mechanical and female kind...no corn fed chicks here
Damion