chryslers most under rated engine

[340-1]

curious as to which chrysler engine would win the rodney dangerfield award "no respect" My vote would be for the 360.

[DartGT66]

A 400 is a good candidate too, not forgetting the 318. I think these are more underrated than the 360 which had some pretty hot versions too, and because of the displacement and other goodies has been used widely on performance build ups for a long time.

[6pakman]

i dont know why anyone would think that the 340 would be even considered a no respect engine. that little motor had gobs of pwr right out of the box. theres so much you can do with that motor with performance upgrades. it never came as a two barrel, it was desigened for high output, you could put the 727b trans behind it.also not to leave out the holley 3 2bbl setup. id pick that motor over a 318 or a 360 any day. the 360 was designed as a replacement emmisions motor. (ie smog). it does have pwr capabilites, but i dont think it could be compared to a 340 when it comes to all out performance.

[rumblefish360]

No one said anything about the 340's lack of respect. In fact it gets lots of it. How about the 273? The 318 or 400 would be next for sure.

[Lee Pritchard]

In hot rod magazine back in the later 60s or 70s i read a story on fords 289 and 302 motors,it said don't waste your time with these engines, they have NO prefromance value and never will.... good thing ford people didn't agree!!!Same story was written about the 400 sb chevy engine, didn't stop the chevy guys!! I know mopar guys that will not build anything but 360s or 400 b motors..Dick Landy proved that a 360 could kill any sb 350 and 351 ford crate motor... Bob Glidden stormed pro stock with a w2 motor.... top fuel and funny car is owned by Hemis.. I'll be happy to run the Rodney Dangerfield of cars...I hear it when i go street racing , here comes that F#@KIN mopar, don't race him that thing is wicked fast!!!.............

[GROCERYGETTER]

My 1st vote is for the 400, it was mostly in big ole Cordobas. A stroked 400 will go alot of places a 440 won't. My 2nd vote is for the /6. Everyone wants to yank them out and replace them with a small block. A properly built /6 in a A body will bring a tear to many a SBF/SBC eye.

[Tim_K]

225 Slant Six.

Except for the rare Hyper-Pak in the early '60's, Mopar never gave it a chance to run. The 110 hp '77-'79 2 bbl. "Super Six" was all it ever got. There could easily have been a 150 hp version of the motor for production. But it did its job very well as a reliable engine that never quit, despite low power numbers in stock form.

My moderately built 168 net hp /6 4 bbl. runs low 16's with 3330 lbs and 3.21 gears. The engine will go into a lighter and faster Duster next summer. And be built up some more.

[Mills]

I'd build a 360 before a 340. Same with the 400 over the 383.

In my opinion, the 400 was by far the most underrated. handicapped with low comp., high (low number) gears, stuffed into big, heavy cars, and cam shafts with lobes that could pass it for a broom stick.

No doubt in my mind the 273 is over looked.

I once talked to an ex-cop. This guy was a die-hard MOPAR man. He told me one story of chasing some punk's 396 Chevelle w/ his /6 pursuit car (back in the 70's). Of course short distances the 396 would make him eat dust. He told me how he held it on this long highway stretch to catch this guy. Held it to the floor for miles! Finally caught the Chevelle after he tossed a rod through his block and found the punk sitting in his car crying how he wrecked his motor.

Mills

[goose]

My vote for most under-rated is the 318... all I ever hear is how that engine is such a piece of junk! Yet all you have to do is put on the exact same performance parts as go into a 340 and that's what you get, is a 340 with a smaller bore. People call the engine crap because they don't make any power, and for some reason most people think there's a performance curse on the engine, that there's something inherently wrong with it that makes it a slug. They don't stop to realize that all it is is a 340 with a smaller bore and different heads, cam, and manifolds. The 340 is always looked at as a great engine. When I talk to people about my smallblock I tell them it's a "smallbore 340" and then they say "ooh, those 340's make power". I tell 'em it's a 318 and the instant response is "what a slug".

[Ausydad]

I think it depends on which catagory you talk about. For /6's, everyone goes with the 225. Great motor, but there are still plenty of 194's out there. Small block, definetly the 273. Talk about under rated motors and everyone starts bragging about 318's. I love the 318, got 3 of them. Big block, I'd go with the 361 from '66 Coronets and the like. Could easily build a stroker motor with those and heads are easy to get as well. Don't hear many people talk about those. Just my thoughts.

[Billydelrio]

In its time, the 273 was a BMF in the A body and had total respect of the Chevy & Ford guys. The 400, as someone else said, was, for the most part, put into low performance applications, as was the 318. My vote would be for the 318 as the most under rated V 8 engine for a performance engne. That is why my next race engine is based on a 318 block! I be gonna whoop some sb chevys with a 318! I am not talking Poly-sphere.

Billy

[JJessico]

My vote is for the 383. Its not underrated as such, but I think it qualifies as a Rodney Dangerfield engine as it really doesn't garner much respect. Big block fans say get the 440, hemi peope say get the hemi, small block people say get a 340. No one really gives a shit about the B blocks. I think its a pretty respectable engine and mine sure does the trick for me. I guess I wouldn't call it underrated but definately not often mentioned/noticed/commented about.

[Doug Wilson]

My vote is for any of the poly engines. You say "poly" and people either say "a what?" or "boat anchor". One of the mags did a poly 318 build up recently and was pulling over 400 horsepower and over 400 pound-feet of torque - yeah, I know it was a stroker, but it's still THE Rodney Dangerfield of the MOPAR engines. This opinion from ...Doug (who doesn't own one).

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!

[6pakman]

sorry guys, for some stupid reason, at the end of the first post i thought he had said 340. it was early for me and i read it wrong. so strike that post from me. i will say though that the 318 or 400 were overlooked. i belive that is because one was a 2 bbl only and the other one was used for replacment big block but was the beginning of the smog era. you can do alot with them but they still have that reputation as being non high performance engines.BUT i'v seen and watched those two engines get built up and slam the door on a few big blocks. good engines for any build up. sorry again for the my short streak of stupidty.

[ol ron]

Well, I gotta tell you, my vote goes to the 361 and the 383. Ran a '65 Belevedere in brackets at lions in the heyday of sportsman racing. That 361 ran consistant 13.9 to 14.2 times with only a Sig Erson HYDRAULIC cam, a factory four barrel manifold, a 600 Holley and 4.11 Suregrip. Stock iron 727, street car with no lightening.
My '70 Dodge 3/4 ton had a 383 four speed that hauled a 10' Lance camper up the Eastern Sierras' towing our CJ7 from L.A. to Bridgeport on many trips without ever slowing to below 40 MPH.
Those were mighty fine engines, friends!
Ron

[Doug Wilson]

Well, I guess everyone has forgotten the '58/'59 B block, 10:1, solid lifter, dual quad, Plymouth Commando(I think) and Dodge Super Red Ram. These hustled pretty well in Savoy 2 door posts with short gears and T/Qs - also Dodge Lancers with the same setup. Just happens that I have one of the original factory iron 2X4 manifolds for this. It's for sale for a lot of money.
So, I guess if it is COMPLETELY ignored, it must be the real Rodney Dangerfield.

[pishta]

How about the 2.2? It was in EVERYTHING all through the 80's and some of the 90's. Lebarons, New Yorkers, Turismos, dusters, you name it. Slap a bigger turbo on it, build the bottom end and port the head and you have a 12.5 second rocket with A/C. How about the 50's 350? Never ever heard a build up on a Mopar 350.

[Doug Wilson]

Sorry, in my last post, I was referring to the B block 350.

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!

[Doug Wilson]

Sorry, again... I didn't mean "T/Qs", I meant T/Fs. Guess I've got ThermoQuads on my mind!!

[GROCERYGETTER]

Regarding 361 and 383. The 361 was really around before what we consider the muscle car era. In 68 the 383 came into its glory years as the STANDARD engine in the RR. What other muscle car had 383 cubes and 330hp STANDARD? The EPA smog and OPEC killed the 383's respect, not lack of performance. As far as respect? I'll take all the 383 RR, Darts, and Cuda's I can find..............(and afford)

[JCFcuda]

In stock form I'll also go with the 2.2 turbo , 40 mpg Hyw and smoked every Z24 that got in my way.
Jim

[goldduster]

I would have to vote for the 318 to be the most under rated engine. the most power it EVER made from the factory was 230 (i own that version) and still was saddled with small valve poor flowing heads and a 2bbl iron intake with an anemic BBD, and the world's smallest cam. Also, the a-body manifolds are about the most restrictive ever devised. What about the standard 1 7/8" single exaust? Yeah, that really helped power

And then it got saddled in cars like diplomats with autos and 2.2:1 rearends. and enough smog equipment to clean up chicago.

Slap in a cam, some decent heads, and a 4bbl with a good intake, and you've got a really good engine.

[Doug Wilson]

I don't think the question said anything about "the muscle car era". What... you don't think there were any fast MOPARS before 1968 Road Runners??? Also, about the 383 cu in/ 330 horsepower - did you maybe forget 390 cu in/ 335 horsepower Fairlanes and Cylones and Mustangs, not to mention about a zillion GM cars and AMCs and Studebakers with better numbers than that???

My vote is still for the MOPAR big block 350, solid lifter, 2X4, 10:1 in a Savoy 2 door post with a TorqueFlite and short gears. I kinda think those might eat your Road Runner, in stock showroom trim. That's a combo that doesn't "get no respect"...until you race one.

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!

[6pakman]

KEEP GOING DOUG, YOUR ON A ROLL!!!!!!

[Karl43]

I vote for the 360 and 400. They were both smog motors designed to replace the 340 and 383 respectively. They game them more cubes than the originals to make up for the choking emissions.

Put the 340 heads and cam on a 360 and Vavoom - it screames like a raped ape. Like the other posts said tell them you have a 360 and they will race you, tell them you have a 340 and they will back off. 360's got no respect because of the performance reputation of the 340.

The 400 was the same. I blew up the 383 in our 69 Road Runner hardtop and bought a 73 Charger that was hit by a snowplow and put the 400 into the Road Runner. When we went to sell it we took it to a meet and my dad followed my brother home in his 69 Road Runner Conv't (440 4-speed). He was impressed with how well the 400 ran. It was bone stock 73 with no modifications. It ran better than the original 383!

The 360 and 400 got no respect bacause they were smog motors designed to replace engines with a good performance reputation already.

I have to give honorable mention to the 318 also as other posts have pointed out. Stock form - no respect. Put 340 heads, cam, intake on them and they fly.

[phoenix]

I'm thinking of doing something really weird just for the goofy looks I'm gonna get from my friends. The recipe calls for a buildup of an old polyhead. This would be a throw-back to my teenage days. I've run/built small and big inchers to death for the last 20 yrs or so, maybe I am going senile, but I'm interested! I flowed a few heads just for a joke years ago and found some real interesting balances/potential albeit the numbers didn't give me a "puffy" if 'ya know what I mean in those days. I'll have to do the sheet-metal intake thing and build headers....doable...but gett'in a cam custom built is the only option I know of. I'll keep you posted but it would/may qualify as a winner in this category.
Hey doug Wilson...what mag had that article?
The bottem end dynamics are there! The head design shows potential for some R&D! This could be fun! Does anybody know if my smallblock torque-plate fits those old poly's?
Thinking real hard! I'm out

[pishta]

Phoenix, it has been done! It was like 500 HP in full race trim!

[GROCERYGETTER]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Doug Wilson

[did you maybe forget 390 cu in/ 335 horsepower Fairlanes and Cylones and Mustangs, not to mention about a zillion GM cars and AMCs and Studebakers with better numbers than that???

All came standard with the trusty inline 6 or a lowpo 8, the performance versions were optional. On the otherhand the 68 RR came with a base engine 383ci/335hp. Sure other hot Mopars came before but not as the standard offering.

I'm saying that if you were around in 68 you would not say that the 383 was underrated.

[Doug Wilson]

Phoenix... The article was in the last year or so, and I think maybe it was Car Craft. I've got the magazine around and I'll see if I can find it and either scan the article and email it to you, or just send the mag.

Other stuff about the poly - early ones used the same block as the equivalent hemis & you could put hemi heads on them with almost no modification. There was also a factory 2X4 manifold available for them, and I think I've got one out behind the barn - if you're interested, I'll look. The 2X4 used small based 4 barrels - like the old style Holleys, Rochesters and Carter WCFBs, and would not flow well for today, but could be Extrude-Honed for better flow. Also, I think Offenhauser and, maybe, Weiand make modern 4 bbl manifolds, as well as 3X2s. As far as headers, I think maybe Sanderson still makes them - It's really not that hard to make your own if you can weld, or have a friendly exhaust shop build them.

Any of the major cam grinders can supply valve train stuff - they may not catalog it, but if you call, you can get it - I'd start with Isky and Racer Brown.

This would be a helluva a lot of fun, like to maybe build a '55 or '56 Plymouth or Dodge as a nostalgia street racer - gutted interior, straight axle, black prime. 450 horsepower in 2300 or 2400 pounds - think it would run??? I'd maybe contribute money, time and stuff to such a project. I just couldn't do the wrenching because of my rotten heart.

My email is ThunderboltRanch@msn.com

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!

[Doug Wilson]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by GROCERYGETTER

Originally posted by Doug Wilson

[did you maybe forget 390 cu in/ 335 horsepower Fairlanes and Cylones and Mustangs, not to mention about a zillion GM cars and AMCs and Studebakers with better numbers than that???

All came standard with the trusty inline 6 or a lowpo 8, the performance versions were optional. On the otherhand the 68 RR came with a base engine 383ci/335hp. Sure other hot Mopars came before but not as the standard offering.

I'm saying that if you were around in 68 you would not say that the 383 was underrated.

I don't want you to think that I'm trying to pick a fight, 'cause I'm not. BUT... I WAS there in '68 (and '58). Fairlane, Mustang & Cyclone GTs and GTAs DID come standard with base engine 390/335 engines. GTOs, 442s, Skylark GSs, Studebaker Lark & Avanti R1s, R2s, R3s & R4s, AMC Rebel Machines, Javelins, AMXs, & Hurst Rambler SCramblers - ALL of these cars, and more came with hot, high horsepower big blocks(whatever their biggest blocks were), in relatively inexpensive packages, starting as early as about '62.

Not to mention the hot small blocks that were out there.

I know because I started drag racing in 1957 in Ohio, and went on to race at the legendary Southern California tracks - Lions, Orange County, Irwindale, Bakersfield and Pamona, as well as the Northern Cal. tracks - Half Moon Bay, Fremont, VacaValley Drag Strip and Sacramento.

Up until '69, I mostly raced Fords, and I can tell you that RoadRunners were WELL respected by their competitors. Guys that sold the RRs short, and put them down, got beat a lot by them.

These are words from on old Fogey named ...Doug

GOD BLESS AMERICA!!