Solid cammer budget 360!!! What do you think???

[Fury Boy]

How do think you this motor would perform???
I am looking for a 13 second Challenger w/ power from 1000-5500 RPMs

basic 9.5:1 CR 360 build w/ .030 over and good rod bolts. Windage tray and baffled oil pan

good distributor and coil, wires, ect...

360 heads from an '85 Cop car w/ 1.88/1.60 valves, 3 angle job and bowl blending

Performer portmatched w/ some plenum work

Hughes HEV3945 Solid, .239/.245 @ 50, 110 LSA, .540 lift, and 273 adjustable rockers

1 5/8 headers w/ a 2 1/2 in exhaust.

650 holley DP

This would all be in a Challenger w/ a 3650 lb race weight. 727 w/ 2700 stall, 3.55 gears and 26 in slicks....


What do you think??? I know I could put it together for under $2500

I would later change to Ebrock heads...

[plumebody]

i don't think those "cop car" valve springs will support that cam. those gears do not seem like enough either. at one time you were doing a "g" machine, have you changed your mind? sounds like a straight line car.

[freak007]

you setup sounds like a VERY nice street machine,and will probably run 14's,your weak point is those heads...
edelbrock heads wold probably help,but Hughes stage 1 iron heads flow better than out of the box eddies at lifts under .550...


I think if you went with something like this:

9.5 compression
hughes stage 1 heads
hughes 239/245 solid cam
3000 stall converter
3.91 gears/28" tires
Weiland Stealth,portmatched
700CFM vac secondary(most people won't use a DP with an auto)
1 5/8 headers,2 1/2 dual exaust
good oiling system
good ignition system


this should get you into a VERY streetable 13.7,if you wanted to put a single plane,and more converter,I think you could run 13 flat


just my $0.02

[AceVeres]

any thoughts about this combo?


360 rebuilt to 9.9:1 compression
Eddelbrock heads
Edelbrock RPM Airgap intake
750 Eddelbrock carb
Hughes HE2430 with 224/230 degrees @ .050", .504"/.515" lift
1 5/8" headers
904 auto tranny
i have no clues on stall converter..
stock 8 1/4 rear end (for now)
dual chain timing electronic ignition
hi-volume oil pump
new bolts when i rebuild

--basically building myself a 360 for my 74 coronet, i think the wieght is about 3600?

[Fury Boy]

.. am building a "g" Machine but that goes fast.

I know that a higher stall would work better but I am buying a trans w/ a 2700 in it already. I will later ugrade to a 9 1/2 incher...

I wasn't talking about using the springs from the cop heads. I know a guy here who does some really good work that will hook me up.

Primarily, I want to go w/ Eddy is because of the 40 lbs and adding 1.6 roller rockers will really make it scream.

I would have the cam set as mild as i could, degreed several degrees! and a wide lash setting. I think I could easily run 13s. Car Craft did a build on a 360 w/ a slightly bigger cam but everything else was pretty close(except for the performer RPM) evern used stock size valves and no porting, just 3 angle job and made 410 HP...

I think this thing would make an easy 380 if done right...

[freak007]

I will list the reasons for the setup I suggested,I think you will agree...


hughes heads are cheaper than edelbrock,and flow better at the lift range of the cam,and have smaller runners,this create more total power,with a wider powerband and better throttle response

239/245 solid cam is a good profile for this type of engine,and works excellent with these heads,also it is a mechanical which is better as well


a buddy of mine runs a hughes converter 3000 stall in his roller camed daily driver,when you accelerate normal it is just like a clutch,and at cruising speed it has only 4-5% slipage,but if you stomp on it is spins op to 3000 and takes off like a bat outta hell,it is a win-win setup



26/3.55 is a good start for street performance,but a challenger needs more tire for better clearance,it you go with 28 inch tire you should be good,but with 28's you would need 3.82 gears to match the performace of the 26/3.55, 3.91's should do it.



the same friend that runs the 3000 stall has also run both the RPM and the Stealth,the stealth ran alot better,better throttle response,better power etc.


most people will agree that it is not smart to run a double pumper with an automatic transmission,it just won't work right


if you put this all together,you get better performance,and better manners...

[Fury Boy]

Yeah, I totally agree with you on the heads, gears and stall converter.

But about the carb, my dad has run his double pumper on the street for a year now and can't say it doesn't have bad manners. I think it drives nice.
Always had problems getting vacuum secondaries to open up and even when we messed with the springs. Plus, I want a 650 dual feed and holley doesn't make that in a vacuum secondary any more...

The whole reason I want eddy heads is basically for weight. I realize that they are a little overkill for under .550 lift heads but someday I planned on getting some 1.6 rollers to replace the 273 rockers I have... Besides that, Stage I heads would cost me $1000 plus shipping. My uncle just bought a pair for his 440. Now, how much cheaper would eddies be???

[freak007]

I am not saying you can't run a double pumper on the street,I said you shouldn't run it with an automatic on the street,my dad had a 68 Cyclone with a 428CJ and a 750 Holley DP,but his car was a 4 speed...also it is easy to "over carb" with the mechanical secondaries,if you got a 700 or 750 vaccum secondary you will most likely be much happier,if you have trouble getting the secondaries open,have a professional do it,it shouldn't be that much,$20-30 and in my opinion it is worth it to save the hassle...


stage 1 heads will cost you $725+your core($150)and shipping
for a total of maybe $1000,and even with the 1.6 ratio rockers they will STILL outflow the eddies,I will try to get some numbers for you...

the Eddies will cost you $1300 plus shipping,and they don't flow anywhere NEAR as well...



so you spend less,get more power,and even though it is 40 pounds heavier,the extra power is worth it,but if you are THAT worried about 40 pounds,I heard you can knock 20 pounds off your front just by putting on aluminum calipers,and if you used aluminum rims all around,'glass hood and or fenders...you could really make up for it and then some

[Fury Boy]

I think your right...

I am looking at speed demon 650 VS

[freak007]

I am not familiar with demon carbs,but from what I hear they are a very good choice,the size may be a little small though,with that cam,esspecially with the 1.6 ratio rockers I think you will nee a 700-750cfm...

[freak007]

keep us updated on your progress!!!

[Fury Boy]

sure will freak, you've really helped!

[biggerhammer]

Furyboy, where are you getting a re-built 360 with all that stuff for 2500 $? the machine work alone would run about 750.00 here, and we tend to be cheaper than most states.

[freak007]

$750 for machining!!!HOLY SHIT!! I can get ALL the block machining done for $300,that includes:

Hot tank
bore and hone
deck the block
install cam bearings
crank Grind and polish
re-size conecting rods
second hot tank


you can get a rebuild OR stroker for hughes for $1750
hughes cam/lifters $250
wieland intake $200
demon carb $400
hughes heads $1000
MP distributor/ICU $175


your total will be closer to $4500

[biggerhammer]

I was adding all the head work too, guides 5 angle valve job surface, with stainless one-piece valves good springs, but includes cost of pistons unless specialty, like domed or coated, cam bearings brass freeze plugs floated rods with hardened rod bolts, but not decking, or balancing. if your guy decks AND bores for three hundred, better take him up on it, here decking by itself runs from 75-125. dollars

[freak007]

he charges $10 a hole to bore and hone,$50 to deck,$10 for plugs,$40 for hot tank(if he does ALL the machining he hot tanks it the second time for free)$60 to grind a polish the crank,$10 each to recondition the rods(+bolts if other than stock) $10 for cam bearings,balancing is extra


the heads include 1 pc SS valves,and a 3 angle job,

[biggerhammer]

what does he use to hone? I had to buy a power-stroke hone to attain the finish REQUIRED by the later model engines so i had to go up (by a measely 2 bucks) to help pay for the hone. the earlier engines were not as finicky in regards to rings and cyl. finish so back then I could get by with using a hand-held hone, much cheaper, also, it costs me about 12.00 a day to meet requirements by the epa as to disposal of my vat juice because of the heavy metals that are in it, can't dispose of it down the drain like we used to. lol, you are extremely lucky you have someone who can do the work that cheap.
there are shops here that get 125.+Just to bore and hone, no decking or torque plate honing either, all extra. I oughta send my stuff up there, be cheaper in the long run LOL