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#1
05-28-2003, 11:29 PM
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Need Help!!
Ok heres the story our challenger has ran fine then we broke the flexplate and pulled the tranny to change it. Now we go to start it and there is no spark. We got a new coil and went home and tried it and it started right up. Then after about 30 seconds it quits again and no spark now again. We got a new voltage regulator new coil new coil wire new points and condensor and we have gone over all the wires but the all are hooked up. This is very odd considering we didnt touch anything in the engine compartment when doing to tranny and now it just cranks with no spark. Any ideas are appreciated we have a show this weekend that we need to be at so we need this resolved.
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#3
05-29-2003, 12:22 AM
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As the engine is cranking, I will rule out the neutral safety switch and the starter relay.
With the key on, are you getting voltage at the coil?? If "no" are you getting voltage at the "IGN 1" side of the ballast resistor? With the key in the Start position, are you getting voltage at the coil?? If "no" are you getting voltage at the "IGN 2" side of the ballast resistor? If you get voltage on either side of the ballast resistor and no voltage at the coil, then the problem is the lead from the ballast to the coil. If you aren't getting voltage at the ballast resistor, during either of these tests, then the problem is the wiring headed back to the ignition switch, the bulkhead connector, or the ignition switch itself. If you are getting good voltage indications, then the problem is with the distributor or the coil.
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#5
05-29-2003, 12:25 AM
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Quote:
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#6
05-29-2003, 01:53 PM
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its a new resistor also and its weird because it started and was running for about a minute and then it started doin it again and we havent changed anything since then. So it was running with the new coil cap and rotor resistor condensor and points for about a minute and then all o the sudden it shuts off and it jut cranks again with no spark so it seems like it shouldnt be any o that new stuff.
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#8
05-29-2003, 02:26 PM
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I dont think its the link because then it wouldnt crank at all if it was that and it cranks fine there just isnt any spark.
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#9
05-29-2003, 02:28 PM
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also the resistor has power on both sides and there is some power going to the coil. I dont have an ohm meter but do have one of the electrical testers that lights up when there is power. The two sides of the resistor and the coil have some light but not real strong.
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#10
05-29-2003, 02:39 PM
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Maybe a bad connection on a wire that got squished when the tranny was removed. The engine may have crunched a wire. A wire that was old and "hard" got tweeked/broken inside the insulation and now isn't conducting electricity properly. Around the firewall area.
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#11
05-29-2003, 03:23 PM
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is there any way to test the coil?
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#12
05-29-2003, 03:29 PM
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Yup, but it's been too long for me to remember how and I don't have the equipment anymore. If you put on one new coil and it worked, then quit working, then something else is making the coil go bad/not work. Like a wire someplace that may have gotten pinched/grounded. Start the engine, if it will, then start wiggling wires all over the engine and firewall and firewall connecter. Any wire you can reach. Smell for hot wires also. Feel for a wire that may be warm. Ignition switch even.
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#13
05-29-2003, 03:47 PM
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that seems like what could be happening because we bought a new coil and it started right up then after like 30 seconds it just shut off and then wouldnt spark again no matter what we did. But i cant find any pinched or crushed wires. There is power going to the positive terminal on the coil. Is there supposed to be power coming off the Negative coil terminal because there isnt
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#14
05-29-2003, 03:53 PM
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The light should be bright, when measuring at the point, where that lead connects to the ballast. If you have a high resistance circuit, then the coil isn't going to fire. See how bright the light is, when checking at the bulkhead connector.
another thing to check is where the coil lead connects to the ballast. It mates with IGN 2 at that point. If there is a lot of corrosion in there, it can cause problems.
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#15
05-29-2003, 04:13 PM
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there is no corrosion it is a brand new resistor im thinking maybe the coil isnt getting enough power and maybe the lead from the harness to the resistor needs to be changed but why all of the sudden would this happen
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#16
05-29-2003, 04:13 PM
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If you have voltage at the + side of the coil but not the - side, then the primary windings are burned out. The fact that you had spark and then it quit supports this as well.
Before you put yet another new coil on, find out why they are burning out! Excessive voltage is the probable culprit, you won't see this with a test light. Get a volt meter. You can pick up a cheap VOM (volt-ohm meter) for under $25, which will be a valuable addition to your tool kit for many other things as well. You shouldn't have more than 6-8 volts at the coil while running, 12 or so while cranking. The purpose of the ballast resistor is to lower the voltage while running, if you're burning them out and have a new balast, I would suspect that the resistor is wired up wrong or is shorted. With your new VOM, measure the voltage coming out of the resistor to the coil, if it's still 12V, that's your problem. Find that, put on a new coil, and you'll be all set.
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#17
05-29-2003, 04:20 PM
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ok ill be getting an ohm meter is a couple of hours so hopefully we can figure this out. It is a new resistor so i dont know how it could be bad but maybe. What could be the cause of too much voltage all of the sudden when it didnt do it before. And why would a brand new resistor not be doing the job
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#18
05-29-2003, 05:56 PM
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It's possible that the resistor is shorted, but unlikely. Most resistor failures result in an open rather than a short. Your new resistor is probably okay.
What is more likely is that the wiring is incorrect or the ignition switch is continuing to feed +12 volts directly to the coil (bypassing the resistor completely) when the key is released from the cranking position. The voltmeter will show this easily, just measure voltage at the + side of the coil with the switch in the normal run position, it should be much less than 12V (but at least 6). (I do hope you're getting a VOM and not just an ohm meter, they are different.)
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#19
05-29-2003, 06:20 PM
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Will i need a new ignition switch if it does stay high with the ignition on because if i need a new switch ill probably be SOL
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#20
05-29-2003, 06:28 PM
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If you still have 12 volts with the switch in the run position that's a problem, but you still need to narrow it down further. It could be the switch, but it could also be a wiring issue. Do you have the wiring diagrams for your car? (A factory service manual is the best investment you can make.)
Test voltages (with the key on) and continuity (with the key off) to trace down wiring gremlins. They can be tough to find on our old Mopars, but you can bet they're there! Mine just yesterday developed a pulsating headlight problem, time for that relay conversion!
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#21
05-29-2003, 06:52 PM
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Ok thank you so much for all the info no i dont have a diagram but i will try everything you have said and i hope it isnt the ignition switch because i probably cant get one before this weekend but well see.
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#22
05-29-2003, 08:09 PM
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Ok i checked the volts and its 14 going in the resistor and 14 coming out with the ignition on and if im doing it right. Do you think it could be the ignition switch?
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#23
05-29-2003, 08:34 PM
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Before I would blame the switch there's a few things I would check. If you unplug the wire from the coil to the resistor, at the resistor, there should be two wires attached to the connector, one to the coil and the other to the START pole on the ignition switch. With that wire unplugged and the switch in the OFF or RUN position, there should be no voltage at all to that wire. Again with those same wires unplugged, there should be voltage at the remaining wire on the resistor, with the swith in the RUN position only, that should be 12V. Then measure the other side of the resistor without any wires attached. It should be less than 12.
If that checks out, leave thos wires unplugged and have someone momentarily turn the key to the START position. You should get 12-14V at the terminal of the unplugged wire, and no voltage at the resistor. If you have voltage to the START wire with the key in any other position, then it's either the switch or there is a short between the wires in the switch harness or at a connector. This will take some measuring with the Ohm meter function to track down. I'm leaving soon for an awards ceremony at my son's school, I'll be unavailable for the next 3 hours or so. I'll check back later and see how you're doing. Good luck!
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#24
05-29-2003, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
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#25
05-30-2003, 10:50 PM
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Ok i did what you guys said and they is 14 goin into the resistor and 14 on the other side of it but when i leave the resistor hooked up and the ignition on it startts to smoke. Also when i crank it and check the volts at the coil and start pole 1 wire that goes into the resistor it is exactly 12 and there is no voltage goin into the other side of the resistor when cranking which is correct i think. But when the ignition key is on both sides of the resistor say 14 and it start to smoke so whats the deal i just put in a new starter switch but i dont know if i want to try and start it if it will just blow another coil.
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#26
05-30-2003, 11:02 PM
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Everything that you saw with the ballast is correct. Smoking in the "on/run" position is because its a new resistor. They get real hot and it is just burning of some of the stuff that is on it. It will stop doing that, after the engine runs for a while.
As a simple test, you can disconnect the distributor from the coil and then connect a wire to the negative side of the coil. Take the coil wire and place it real close to a ground. with the key in the 'on/run' position, take the wire that you connected and hold the other end on a ground for a second or so and then remove it from the ground. when you remove it, you should get a spark jump on the coil wire. If you don't, then the new coil was faulty and needs to be replaced. If you do get the spark jump, then the problem is in the distributor. It's not unusual for a new coil to be faulty. Most places will give you a refund, if you bring it back as a DOA.
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#27
05-30-2003, 11:15 PM
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Ok but the ballast has 14 volts going in and 14 volts coming out i thought it was supposed to be less coming out going into the coil its also our third new ballast
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