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Old 04-05-2005, 02:31 AM
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Stoga Stoga is offline
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Default Maybe Bob Lutz jumped ship to GM a lil too soon?

According to this link, Bob Lutz, Vice Chairman and Group Vice President President Gary Cowger have given charge of the North American unit to GM's CEO Rick Wagoner.
http://money.cnn.com/2005/04/04/news...ship/index.htm

Looks like things are still not so rosy in the old General's house these days...
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Old 04-14-2005, 05:07 PM
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"Jumped ship?"

Don't you mean "forced out?"

The media reports I remember from back during takeover days stated he was made "unwelcome" by the new ownership.

Is this wrong?
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Old 04-14-2005, 11:37 PM
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wish he would come back to chrysler
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Old 04-14-2005, 11:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canuck Dart
"Jumped ship?"

Don't you mean "forced out?"

The media reports I remember from back during takeover days stated he was made "unwelcome" by the new ownership.

Is this wrong?
I remember that some part of Chrysler management got the ol heave-ho, but it would appear that Lutz was hired away by GM according to this link.
http://www.time.com/time/archive/pre...001598,00.html
That link may or may not work, Time.com is hustling for subscriptions.
The info should be out there though.

Lutz was wanted by a Mr Wagoner at GM, it was a big messed up deal for sure.
Some were forced out by the merger, I just dont think that Lutz was one of them, then again, maybe he was hearing footsteps and decided to get out when the getting was good. Thing is, looks like DC is on the upswing, while GM is kind of struggling these days, which is the real point.
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Old 04-15-2005, 06:39 PM
Canuck Dart Canuck Dart is offline
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Hmmmm - I had thought he was already gone from Chrysler for some time before GM hired him...maybe I'm wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoga
Thing is, looks like DC is on the upswing, while GM is kind of struggling these days, which is the real point.
Yeah - this is true - however, My opinion is that there would likely have been no "downswing" for DCX to recover from and generate the current "upswing" had Bob Lutz stayed at the helm.

I mean let's think back to the mid '90's: The recently re-designed Ram & Dakota,(best looking truck ever made by anyone, ever was that Ram IMO.) the excitement generated by the PT cruiser then the viper for the rich folks. Even some of the wrong-wheel drive stuff like the new minivans were groundbreaking if you go for that sort of thing...

Had Daimler-Chrysler truly been the "merger of equals" as advertised - had dynamic people like Lutz been kept on board instead of being chased away - had German engineering excellence been combined with North-American balls & styling...we would be looking at a monster IMO...Now we just have a watered down version of Mercedes. A sad missed opportunity I think - too bad - it could have been awsome.

At any rate, it's also quite possible that now, 8 or 9 years later at 70+ years old, Mr. Lutz needs to hang up his spurs...at GM or anywhere...
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Old 04-15-2005, 06:46 PM
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OK Stoga and Canuck Dart, How do you think things would be if Lee Iacocca was brought back, or had never left? Would we have a better Mopar or worse?
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Old 04-15-2005, 09:59 PM
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Darn, you guys ask some hard questions! To be honest, I'm just going along with the flow at this point. Chrysler, Daimler-Chrysler , Benz, whatever they want to call themselves almost lost me back when they dumped Plymouth.
Thing was, I looked at what GM, Ford and the imports were pumpin out and didnt see anything that appealed to me. I was close to where automotive brand names meant as much to me as a refridgerator or washing machine brands.
Luckily, the new 300 and Magnum, the continuing appeal of the Ram trucks and the upcoming Charger have helped me keep interest. Also, my 96 Plymouth and 2000 GC continue to serve me well, even though both are starting to get some miles on them.
Pride-wise, I would have preferred to seen Chrysler stay as an independent company, but I think once all the growing pains have settled, DC will end up as a stronger international company than either brand would have on it's own. I could gripe and pick at DC, but what's done is done. All they have to do is keep making appealing and reliable machinery at this point.
I think if Lee Iacocca hadnt left, he'd have retired by now. He was born in 1924 and should be around 81 years old. I think he would have done ok, let's face it , the K-cars and minivans did save the company!
The only thing it may have done is delayed the merger, and if it had prevented it, I dunno how strong Chrysler Corp would have been at this point, though I like to think they'd have went on regardless.
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Old 04-15-2005, 10:58 PM
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Well - I was actually pretty pumped up about the "merger" when it was announced. Again that whole American/European thing seemed like a good idea to me. What transpired was one disapointment after another for me. The destruction of Mopar Performance - the housecleaning in the styling & management depts, and sorry - the new line up leaves me cold, styling wise. The V8/RWD is cool, but they wrapped it in some pretty ugly packages IMO. (Seen the most recent restyle of the Ram for 2006??- - Ick.)

It seems to me there is a culture of goofy front-end treatments at DCX these days. It's almost as if they have a thing going where they are trying to see who can come up with the most "over the top" vehicle nose. There is not a single vehicle in the Chrysler stable for me. After 22 years of buying nothing but..that concerns me.

The Plymouth thing bugged me too - but the writing was on the wall for Plymouth long before Daimler came on the scene. I'm sure that it would be gone by now had the takeover never happened. But I dunno - I still think it would have been better if it were that "merger" and Lutz had stayed on rather than the
"takeover."

For me - it ain't mopar any more...it's mercedes - they are going to have to do a lot to convince me otherwise - it's almost time for us to buy our next new vehicle...
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Old 04-16-2005, 03:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canuck Dart
The V8/RWD is cool, but they wrapped it in some pretty ugly packages IMO. (Seen the most recent restyle of the Ram for 2006??- - Ick.)
I've noticed from posts here on Moparchat and elsewhere that the styling has really got some folks upset. I haven't seen the new Ram yet, but I have the feeling in the current market, conservative conventional styling just wont be enough to get the market's attention.
The other thing is, I remember Mopars like the 61 Plymouth, 60-62 Valiant-Lancer, the stamped from a cookie cutter K cars and even though I liked all those very much, they strike me as a bit ungainly looking. In fact, that's even part of their charm!.
BUT, the styling was never so bad as to turn me off completely. I'd happily snatch up a 62 Plymouth or Dodge Max Wedge or 61 Plymouth Sonoramic Belvedere and be tickled pink, despite what people think of their styling, either then or now!! Same thing with the new Charger, which is to me the best way to get a New Hemi in the lightest package at the least price.
Don't forget the Magnum-300s got slammed pretty hard on this website too when they came out, yet they've been a sales success for DC.
When you say it isnt Mopar anymore, dont forget there are also Benz guys in German saying it isnt Mercedes anymore either. I'm sure there were some flathead fans upset about the new Hemi in 1951 too!
If you think that a Tercel, or a Lexus or a Monte Carlo or a 500 is more your preference, well, that's up to you.
Myself, I'm not going to compare 2006 Daimler-Chrysler to 50s or 60s Chrysler Corp. I'm going to compare them to whats on the market now, and compared to generic imports, boring Ford and just odd or outdated vehicles from GM,
I think the current New Mopars are much more appealing.
Whether they are a Chrysler or a Benz doesnt really matter to me, but I do have an answer to that question. They are both and neither!!
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