Wheel Size?

[moparots]

Hey All, Time for the Charger to get some new "Shoes". Id like to put on a classic set of 15" wheels (instead of the old 14's), Something like SS Cragars or old "Slots". Ive been researching eBay, Summit, American Racing, Ect... Getting lots of different prices, products, sizes.

What is everybodys thoughts on what looks good on a 73 Charger.

How wide can you go in the rear without moving springs ( Ive heard 10") How about staggering the width.. IE: 7's in front ..... 8's or 10's in back . What is the advantage/disadvantage of that.

I saw a couple of eBay items for sale ... with 14" wheels in front and 15" wheels in back ( I suppose thats for people who like that "jacked" up rear look) (personally I dont care for that)

How about Tire sizes? any thoughts??? Thanks for ALL input Craig.....

[ldillon]

Hello,
I'm looking for a stock set of restorable 14 inch steel wheels for a '67 Dodge. If you do up grade, I might be interested in your old wheels.
Thanks for your time,
L. Dillon

[riquiscott]

I have American Racing Torque-Thrust II's on my '72 Charger. Fronts are 17 X 7" with 225/50-17, and the rears are 17 X 8" with 255/45-17. They fill up the wheelwell pretty well and clear all of the suspension components with no problems. I could have probably gone with the 9.5" rims in the back, but it would have been close with the springs.

[dwc43]

I have 15 x 10's all around on my '72 with 255 60 15's I think. I'll have to check to make sure. You'll get the most tire and wheel with this set up and it will give you the best handling. Make sure what ever you do to stay with 15" 60 series tires and wheels. This will get you the best handling and traction for acceleration. Bigger wheels are heavier, therefore increasing unsprung weight which limits handling and the lower profile tire changes the slip angle which reduces handling. The larger wheel also take longer to accelerate and to stop. So keep that in mind too.

[turbododge]

DWC keeps telling us all the virtues of small diameter wheels and tires. This topic came up repeatedly at the Carcraft show in St Paul last weekend. We have 16 and 17" on the Chally with Z speed rated tires, and many folks stopped to talk about tire sizes and ratings. The common line was that they could not find speed rated tires in the sizes for their muscle cars. (15" -235 wide and up), so many were collecting info on upsizing.

DWC has repeatedly said that speed rated 15" in our sizes exist, but nobody seems to be able to find them, except for a single size of SUV tire.

All the other times this has come up, DWC has said he didn't have time to find the sources of the tires, but how bout you take the time and let us all know where to get them. I get asked about this very question at least twice a month, so I would sure like to have a better answer than "I have heard they are available, but I don't know where".

You can do a search on here and find several very extensive threads on the subject.

[dwc43]

Local shops. What ever is cheapest. Don't run too many speed rated though. Not worth the the extra cost really. Your better off with some of the cheaper tires Reason is, they use softer rubber and they wear out quicker so you'll come back and buy more. Best part about softer rubber, it equals more traction, that's why they were out quicker. Best to take a durometer and buy your tires by the durometer reading and tread design for the intended purpose.

[gthomas]

[QUOTE=moparots] How wide can you go in the rear without moving springs ( Ive heard 10") How about staggering the width.. IE: 7's in front ..... 8's or 10's in back . What is the advantage/disadvantage of that.QUOTE]

I made the big mistake and went with 15x10's in the rear. If you do.... you will drastically limit your tire selection. IMHO go with 15x8's, they'll allow you to go with a much wider range of tires. The best site to check out tires and their required rims sizes is to go to: www.tirerack.com You'll find only a couple of tires that'll work with 10" rims. Worst of all you'll end up with BFG's, no traction and speed ratings that will run out in a block if you really put the gas to the car.

Personally I'd go with 16x8's in the rear and install one of the good drag radials on them. The fronts will be fine with 15 inch rims.

I measured my own clearances with my A-Body and had rims made that were exactly dead center in the wheelwells. All I did was run plumbs from the outside fender lip, the face of the drum and the springs. Wrote down the measurements and figured out the offset for the rims, then had Center Line make me a set of rims.

[turbododge]

Local shops. What ever is cheapest. Don't run too many speed rated though. Not worth the the extra cost really. Your better off with some of the cheaper tires Reason is, they use softer rubber and they wear out quicker so you'll come back and buy more. Best part about softer rubber, it equals more traction, that's why they were out quicker. Best to take a durometer and buy your tires by the durometer reading and tread design for the intended purpose.

So--are you still saying speed rated 15" exist or not?

The idea that a cheap tire will handle better than a speed rated tire is ludicrous. Durometer is a very poor indicator of traction capability on pavement. Although you will find that high traction/high performance tires are of a soft durometer, that is not entirely why they hold better. A cheap, low durometer tire, will not hold as well. Remember that the slip of a tire, especially a cheap tire, is because the rubber itself is fracturing and being left on the pavement, not because the tire is sliding on the pavement. Better tires have much stronger rubber and don't separate as easily. Even if the cheap tire had the same coefficient of friction between it and the road, it would still slide a lot sooner. This is why you get skid and burnout marks. If the tire was sliding on the pavement ther would be no marks.

Add to this better sidewalls to hold the tread flat, better heat resistance, etc., etc and the cheap tire theory is not viable. Got any test data??

[dwc43]

Yes, 15" speed rated tires still exist. I've run them. Just not worth the extra cash. And durometer reading mean almost everything. We use them alot in our racing events and you wont find a pro without one. Come on down to one of our tracks one night and we will give you a lesson in tire management.

[turbododge]

As we have asked so many times before. Where do you get a set of speed rated 235-60-15 and 255-60-15 speed rated tires? No one I know has found them. You keep saying they exist, but won't source them or even give a manufacturer. Please let us know how to get them.

A durometer at the race track is used for many things. As I said, low durometer is important in high performance tires, but, what I also said is that a low durometer cheapo tire will not come anywhere near a hipo tire of the same durometer in performance.

If what you are saying is true, racers would all be running cheapo Walmart tires, and I sure don't ever see that happening.

I would love to see you guys run. What track do you run at? Car numbers and classes? Driver names?

[gthomas]

[QUOTE=turbododge]As we have asked so many times before. Where do you get a set of speed rated 235-60-15 and 255-60-15 speed rated tires? No one I know has found them. You keep saying they exist, but won't source them or even give a manufacturer. Please let us know how to get them. QUOTE]

I've done hours of research and many phone calls, and there isn't any wide 15 inch tires with any type of good speed ratings.

And I agree with you, el cheapo tires such as the BFG Radial TA's that I am running on my car are dangerous and produce the worst traction you can imagine. Just putting a little power to the car getting on the freeway will go pass the speed rating very quickly.

I recently took my car to the strip and it was like running on water. EVERY gear change or any type of serious power did nothing but produce excessive wheel spin. I tried many different air pressures and not one of them worked. On one run I changed into another gear about 2/3 down the strip and went sideways, backed off a little and gave full power and ended up sideways at the finish. I will never go back until I buy some "real" tires, and they will not be "el cheapo's".

[turbododge]

from Turbododge

As we have asked so many times before. Where do you get a set of speed rated 235-60-15 and 255-60-15 speed rated tires?

From DWC

Yes, 15" speed rated tires still exist. I've run them.

From Gthomas

I've done hours of research and many phone calls, and there isn't any wide 15 inch tires with any type of good speed ratings

DWC: Why will you not tell us where you can get these tires? By saying they exist on thread after thread, you are sending folks (many time newbees) on wild goose chases, as they can't find them. This hurts the credibility of the entire board. If they exist, let us know where. If they don't, lets move on and get to something more useful.

From DWC

Come on down to one of our tracks one night and we will give you a lesson in tire management.

From Turbododge

I would love to see you guys run. What track do you run at? Car numbers and classes? Driver names?

DWC: You made the offer, just give me the info, and if I am in the area I will drop in to see what is up.

[dwc43]

Originally Posted by turbododge

As we have asked so many times before. Where do you get a set of speed rated 235-60-15 and 255-60-15 speed rated tires? No one I know has found them. You keep saying they exist, but won't source them or even give a manufacturer. Please let us know how to get them.

A durometer at the race track is used for many things. As I said, low durometer is important in high performance tires, but, what I also said is that a low durometer cheapo tire will not come anywhere near a hipo tire of the same durometer in performance.

If what you are saying is true, racers would all be running cheapo Walmart tires, and I sure don't ever see that happening.

I would love to see you guys run. What track do you run at? Car numbers and classes? Driver names?

LAst ones I got was from Prossers shop. Depends on what your using the tire for. For street use, el cheapo with a low durometer reading will do just fine in almost evercase. Depends on whats in the car. I can send you to some racers with some actual wal mart tires on there cars and that's no joke. It's more like tracks. Duck River, Winchester, Riverview closed, I hate that and hope it reopens soon. Have a lic. for The Rim but we have not run up there yet, but hope to real soon. Classes, Superstreet, and Outlaw Pony on dirt, NAScar G.N. Sportsman and Front Runners on asphalt for now. We also used to run some SCCA stuf a few years back. #'s 40,41,43,1,65. Jerry,Brian, and David for drivers. I know we have used some others, but there names escape me at the moment. I can remember a guys face forever, but can't remember his name if I don't use it on a regular bassis.

[dwc43]

[QUOTE=gthomas][QUOTE=moparots] Worst of all you'll end up with BFG's, no traction and speed ratings that will run out in a block if you really put the gas to the car.

QUOTE]

Depends on what you using BFG's on. I've seen them run just fine on some cars. Brother ran them on a dirt car for a year or so and they worked great all season. Never out of the top 5. If your using them on a heavy car and drag racing them, I agree, they wont work. It's touring tire and works real well for auto crossing and dirt track racing. I have not run them on an asphault track though.

[dwc43]

Originally Posted by turbododge

from Turbododge

You made the offer, just give me the info, and if I am in the area I will drop in to see what is up.

Uuuummmm, already did. Come on down to Tn. and we'll got to a race. I belive Frankendart will be comming up from Ga. in Sept. for some Mopar Action.

[gthomas]

[QUOTE=dwc43][QUOTE=gthomas]

Originally Posted by moparots

Worst of all you'll end up with BFG's, no traction and speed ratings that will run out in a block if you really put the gas to the car.

QUOTE]

Depends on what you using BFG's on. I've seen them run just fine on some cars. Brother ran them on a dirt car for a year or so and they worked great all season. Never out of the top 5. If your using them on a heavy car and drag racing them, I agree, they wont work. It's touring tire and works real well for auto crossing and dirt track racing. I have not run them on an asphault track though.

My '72 Duster has been on a certified scale and weighs 2970 w/half tank of gas. With me in it it weighs 3150 - 3160 and no matter what tire pressure I've tried, it won't pull traction when I put some serious gas to it while running BFG TA's. I am going to order some new rims (15x8) and would appreciate anyones suggestion about what tire to get. I can only run a tire that has a section width of 10.8 I'm thinking either Hoosiers or MT's. Someone has also mentioned McGeary tires, and understand that some Firestone dealers carry them. Because of my gears I'd like to get a tire thats 27 inches tall.

[dwc43]

We used to run the Hoosiers some time back, but once they changed the tread pattern they did not work as well. So I'll pass on those for now untill they change something.

Depends anyway. What kind of hp do you have? And what's the purpose of the car? Like drag, roadrace, street car, etc. etc. No matter what the use a 60 series tire will give you the best traction and handling. It could fall off some if used as a drag only size due to the need for sidewall flex for standing still tracion on launched. Plus on a drag car where foot print is more important than anything else and if your limited in width due to wheel well size you can go taller and gain foot print as well, but it could make you change gears too if you go too tall.

[gthomas]

Originally Posted by dwc43

We used to run the Hoosiers some time back, but once they changed the tread pattern they did not work as well. So I'll pass on those for now untill they change something.

Depends anyway. What kind of hp do you have? And what's the purpose of the car? Like drag, roadrace, street car, etc. etc. No matter what the use a 60 series tire will give you the best traction and handling. It could fall off some if used as a drag only size due to the need for sidewall flex for standing still tracion on launched. Plus on a drag car where foot print is more important than anything else and if your limited in width due to wheel well size you can go taller and gain foot print as well, but it could make you change gears too if you go too tall.

Its driven on the street with the BFG TA's, but I want to get a complete set (rims & tires) to drive at the strip. I'm running a 3600 stall and am thinking it would be best to get it to launch around 2600 rpm or so. The torque is 450 at 3750rpm and 420hp at 5750rpm. Tranny is a 727 built by AA out in Lancaster CA. The springs were set up by BLE in Northridge and consist of SS Springs (2 left). The time I took it to the strip I was pretty disappointed due to having to drive it off the line and then not really hammer it like it needs to be. I'm hoping (dreaming if its possible) to get into the high 12's with the car, but knowing I don't have a chance until I can get the power to the ground.

[dwc43]

I got to mid 11's on some crappy Firestones a few years ago, so you should be able to do that. If you don't drive it too much on the street, I'd use a DOT cheater slick out back and the narrowest tallest front tire that would fit under the fender. E/T's seem to work real well, but I have not tried the Hoosier tire, but some say it's pretty good, but that's hersay you know. Those 2 left SS springs wont help you much though. By not using the right SS spring you lost the preload on the chassis on that side.

[DusterBill]

Did a little diging and the only Z rated tire that met the request (235+ and 15") that I have found is the Dunlop SP Sport 8000. This tire is offered in a 245/50-15. MSRP $195

http://www.dunloptires.com/dunlop/di...ea=Performance

Hope this helps.

DB

[turbododge]

LAst ones I got was from Prossers shop

Got a link or phone number for us?

[turbododge]

DWC: Would that be Prosser Automotive and Wrecker in Shelbyville on E. Lane Street?

[turbododge]

DWC: You still with us?? Sure would be nice to get this put to bed once and for all!!

[dwc43]

Uummm, let me look. There's two Prossers. Freddy and Chris. No relation though. Chris has a tire/garage and he's the one you want. I could have sworn that he was on Rail Road Ave. I;'ll have to check for ya.

[turbododge]

Just thought I would bring this back to the top. DWC, you find out which one we want to talk to, and how to get a hold of him yet?

[73Cudaswap]

Not to stir the waters anymore than they already are, but larger wheels don't always come out to heavier, if you're talking about a true race wheel.

The race manufacturers take into account the larger size and weight and make accomodations for it, granted you are talking about a larger rolling resistance which translates into more time to get them to turn, let alone stop, but the actual weight doesn't always come into effect.

[turbododge]

One more time to the top.

DWC, you still with us?

[hellhound]

Originally Posted by dwc43

Local shops. What ever is cheapest. Don't run too many speed rated though. Not worth the the extra cost really. Your better off with some of the cheaper tires Reason is, they use softer rubber and they wear out quicker so you'll come back and buy more. Best part about softer rubber, it equals more traction, that's why they were out quicker. Best to take a durometer and buy your tires by the durometer reading and tread design for the intended purpose.

I had z rated tires on my mustang back years ago...man they wore down fast....and I didnt think the performance gain was anywhere near what you pay for. Let me add that I used to drive really fast too...those tires got used.

[TL]

Let me try . Raceing on a dirt oval you may not need z rated tires. And 60 series are the thing to have. On the other hand. Pavement road course tires need to be speed rated and high dollar low profile tire are better? What i read about ONE LAP OF AMERICA. These high end tires do not last long on an oval. I am all for safety but have used cheep tires on cars and gone pretty fast on country roads before there were speed rateings.

[TL]

If my Challenger ever gets to its pro touring/trans am car finish. I was going for 15x8 rims with 255/60-15 and 275/60-15 tires. No speed rated available. Any advise? Don't go to fast?