Settling engine???

[ttraut@unlockit]

I posted this under Not Shifting into Reverse but got no responses so I thought I'd created a new thread.

My original problem/symptom was that my 4-speed wouldn't shift into reverse on my 69 RR with newly installed 440. It worked for a while (100 miles or so) and now grinds when I try to shift it into reverse. With advice from you guys, I figured out that I needed to adjust the linkage.

Well, after making the adjustment (tightening the clutch linkage 3/8"), shifting was smooth as silk... for about an hour (and a couple of "test holeshots").

Now the grinding of gears when shifting into reverse is back.

Looking underneath, it seems like the engine is settling in. The problem is that the oil pan is sitting right on the steering linkage now; there used to be about 1/16" space between the pan and the linkage bar.

Thinking that my new engine mounts may be damaged allowing the engine to slide around (which may account for the clutch problems) and down (which may account for the engine resting on the steering linkage), I jacked the engine up until the front wheels started coming loose.

There's definite wear happening from the steering linkage. And it wasn't a problem when I first installed the engine. I've attached a picture. This is after 150 miles of driving.

1) Does a new engine on new mounts "settle in"?

2) The engine mounts I installed were to be used with my 383 but I never got around to installing them; are the motor mounts the same for the 440 (which is what I have in the car now) as for the 383?

3) When I rev the engine with the clutch pushed in, I can definitely feel the torque of the engine as it's transferred up through the clutch pedal. Should there be that much movement in the engine?

4) Thoughts?

Thanks!!!!!

Terry

[ehostler]

The 383 and the 440 use the same mounts.

Your new mounts may be of poor quality and have compresed.

[Ray Bell]

Is it possible you have the mounts in upside down... or the left one on the right... or anything like that?

1/16" clearance just would not be right in any production car.

[skankweirdall]

Yeah 1/16" clearance is not right. You may want to go with solid engine mounts for that application. They aren't really that bad and they would help a bunch with a four speed. Moroso makes them I think.

[66Dodge]

Yup. I had the same problem.
The oil pan just barely rubbed against the centerlink. When I put in new motor mounts the engine sat about an inch higher.
I could see on the old motor mounts that the rubber had compressed.
Be careful with the under hood clearance when you get new motor mounts.

[ttraut@unlockit]

Thanks for the responses. The motor mounts are new. I don't remember where I got them; I think Mancini. The rubber doesn't compress much if at all when I lower the engine.

It's a 1972 440 in a 69 B-body. The oil pan is the a 669; I don't know if it's original but it has a relatively shallow pan (1.5") where the steering link cuts across it.

I'm 90% positive everything's in correctly (I followed the service manual and it looks exactly like it's supposed to); however, I also tend to goof up so I'm leaving 10% out there for my lack of knowledge.

Regarding the solid motor mounts, what are your opinions?

How about it I heat and bend the idler arm and the other arm?

[skankweirdall]

Do not bend any steering arms!

[ttraut@unlockit]

I'm not sure if this will make any difference but I jacked the engine up so it was supporting the weight of the front end. Then I torqued the bottom bolts where the motor mount attaches to the K-frame to 55ft-lbs.. They seemed loose (perhaps 40 ft-lbs).

When I lowered the engine, I have about 1/4" space between the pan and the steering link.

Do you think that will do it?

I'm going to take it out for a check later on this afternoon and will give you a report.

Terry

[ttraut@unlockit]

Well, tightening the bolts helped some but occaisionally the shifting problem comes back and it's not due to the engine settling.

The engine seems to "move" from about 1/8" above the steering link to about 3/4" above. Is this normal? Doesn't seem to be. (At least it's not hitting the link anymore.)

Still not sure what's causing the shifting problem, though.

BTW, the mounts ARE in correctly and they are not compressed.

Any more thoughts?

Thanks!

Terry

[Dick]

Was your car ever in a front end collision? Have any parts of the frame been welded, straightened, repaired in any way? Was this ever a problem before all the work to the engine/tranny was done? Are you sure you have the right mounts? How about the transmission mount? Are they OEM or aftermarket?

I am grabbing at straws here, but maybe a new idea might come your way.

[Dick]

Are the bolts new? Too long, maybe? Washers missing?

[ttraut@unlockit]

Thanks Dick. I didn't have this problem with the 383 so it's happened since I replaced the engine. The mounts are new, the connecting hardware is what I pulled from the old set-up; whether it's correct is HIGHLY suspect since everything else was held together with drywall screws and duct tape!

The transmission mount also is brand new.

You put me onto something, though. I'm going to check my parts CD to see what bolts SHOULD be used.

It's just WEIRD how this engine seems to move up and down...

Terry

[pishta]

That is not the right pan, 699 pan was a mid 72 through 73 C body stamping date only. May be deeper than the original pan. No idea on the settling problem.

[ehostler]

It is normal for the engine to move up and down. The mounts are designed to flex to an extent. Solid mounts will prevent all flex. Scumacher has mounts with very limited flex (hybrid btween solid and rubber mounts).

[pishta]

I think they are called Magnum mounts.They are a captive metal mount with a rubber insulator, kinda like a flat spool mount. If the rubber gave out, they would still be locked together by the metal.

[Dick]

True, up and down movement is normal as well as a little roll from the torque effect. But, his engine is moving enough to affect the clutch adjustment, which is the problem.

[ehostler]

He has a total of 5/8" of motor flex. That should not be enough to cause shift linkage problems.