Bush Lifter Bores or Not???

[500B1Stroker]

I am currently building a 500ci stroker motor starting with a 400 Block, Eagle Stroker Crank, JE 14.5:1 Race Pistons, Manley H-Beam Rods, B-1 Aluminum Heads, CC Camshaft around 800 lift, Jesel Shaft Rockers, etc. My concern is do I need to bush and sleeve the lifter bores for better oiling control or does the stock design suffice. The engine should make close to 900HP. I have been hearing alot about Mopar oiling issues when you get to this range and was looking for someone who has more experience with this issue.

[lenweiler]

I've never bushed any of my big blocks, since I've never gone that radical. My Max Wedge had the dual milodon oiling system, which McCandeless said was all I needed.
I've bushed my small blocks for the oiling issue but I also had access to a great machinist. Not only were the bores brought back to optimum specs., and thus, controlling oil miscues, he corrected the lifter angles that were, shall we say, left "wanting" from the factory. Money well spent. Especially in your case.

[sanborn]

Bushing the lifter bores does help to better control the oiling of an engine. But, on a BB especially, the lifter bore accuracy sometimes leaves something to be desired. Just for fun, stick a cam in and check the opening/closing on EACH cylinder. I think you may find enough inaccuracy to justify sleeving the lifter bores.

[500B1Stroker]

The more I think about it the more I have questions, my machinist says he never bushes any of his stuff and he is a very respected engine builder BUT he is mostly a Chevy man. Chevy or Mopar I can see bushing to correct flaws in the geometry of the valvetrain, but heck I should have just bought an aftermarket block till all this machining is finished. I guess the question is, is it worth the money. As sanborn said I guess it comes down to the particular block in question, if I notice alot of inacuracies I may bush. Now if it was mostly an oiling issue, than it needs to be addressed. I have invested in Crower's Severe Duty P/R oiling roller lifters which for $520 should address any oiling issue. I found out that the Jesel system almost requires such oiling as it blocks off some oiling alleys. This, I believe should take care of any oiling issues. I am gonna flip a coin soon, well many coins if I decide to bush ($400 w/parts).

[lenweiler]

It takes a special tool to truely fix the angles. That alone, should be enough of a determining factor. At least at that shop.

[sanborn]

A friend who primarily builds GMs says that over 50% of the GM blocks need lifter bore bushings. His shop produces about 50 race engines per year.

[BDS 871 Cuda]

Sounds like a better part of 15 to 20 grand going into this motor.
I was just wanting to know if you plan on using the new main stud girdle from Hughes Engines or something close to that?
For that kind of HP, a main stud girdle or the Pro-Gram 4 bolt mains are a must.
With the cost of the new mains and with lifter boring, I would think less money would be spent on a Mopar Mega block.
The Mega block will stand up to over 1500 HP.

[toad490]

Originally Posted by lenweiler

It takes a special tool to truely fix the angles. That alone, should be enough of a determining factor. At least at that shop.

Hi Len, do you know off hand what the tool is called? I'm thinkin of bushing my block and I'd like too sound like I know something when I talk to the machine shop.

[500B1Stroker]

BDS - Yes, we got the Hughes Stud Girdle and custom made Billet Main Caps. We are hoping it will deal with a few shots of juice, estimated 1000-1100HP max. Again, most times it will be on motor only and "Special Occasions" on juice (100-250HP). Actually we have about $13K into motor so far, less carb and pan setup, our machine shop gave us great deals on machining and parts. I would estimate $15K complete. It is going in a 68 Cuda, Dana 60, 727 w/ Dynamic Converter, 2950lbs, etc. We are tossing the idea of the need for external oiling, super stock pan, etc. The stroker setup makes increasing the pickup to 1/2" very close clearances and I have been told that as long as we can keep the 3/8" oiled we should be fine but............. We are contemplating a Koffels Place super stock pan/external oiling setup. Regarding the bushing, I am convinced that there is no need if using the Crower P/R oiling setup and making sure the bottom end oiling system has plenty of oil available so if there are any oil return issues from top end it will not effect oil pressure on bottom and the 9qt pan should solve any issues. I would rather have too much oil than not enough. Those lifters were not $521 for nothing. Thanks for the input, I an open to all comments/concerns.

[500B1Stroker]

The macine shop is Jensen's Engine Tech (www.jensensenginetech.com . Andy Jensen is a well reputable builder in this area and has 6 second Pro Mod cars so he definately knows what he is doing, he is just not an all out mopar builder, he specializes in GM. He is not out to get all your money, he tells you if he thinks you need it and if not he wont recommend you get it. Check out his site, his cars kick butt.

[tprice]

I started out with no bushings, just blocking off one oil galley to control oil leakage. Lifters, roller or flat tappet that have the groove in the body, will dump oil pressure out of the bottom of the bore with higher lift cams. You can cheap out like I did at first, but remember to block off the oil galley or oil pressure will suffer. If you decide to do this make sure you do the correct side (I can't remember, I'd have to look at the block again). Email if you want to try this, but its kind of a shakey fix, in my opinion. You can buy lifters that don't have the groove (I think Comp Cams carries these). I went the really expensive way soon thereafter and bought the bushing fixture for BHJ for around $2K. Now I'll bush all my blocks, but only cuz I bought this expensive tool and feel obliged to use it now. If I had to do it over again, I'd just buy the proper lifters and save the $$$.

Good luck with the motor!

Tony

[Tarrbabe]

But I remember reading in the big book that Mother says the only reason to bush the lifter bores is when you go to roller cam. Of course you should also check for wear first and angle to assure you don't need correction.

Just thinking out loud.