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Iceman01
07-17-2003, 03:25 AM
Newbie needs help! Love to restore and drive original MOPAR iron, but admit knowing little about modified performance engines.

Problem is I just bought a very nice ride with an engine that is WAY too hot for the street. It's a 71 Satellite Sebring Plus with transplanted built-up 440 Six Pack. Bought it because the body only has 88,000 miles on it, and is completely original/unmolested except for the moter upgrade. Intend to restore it, drop the horsepower a notch, and drive it during the 3 warm months of non-snow here in Alaska.

Want to keep the 440. A very lumpy Isky cam is currently installed, but the deal also included an NOS Hemi grind purple cam bought from Direct Connection in 1979. Receipt says it's part #P3690214. The previous owner said if I swapped the cams, it would be streetable.

Does this sound reasonable, or is it far more involved?

Knowledgable advice appreciated!

ehostler
07-17-2003, 04:47 PM
IT really depends on what the compression ratio is. If it is 10.5:1 or less, the cam swap should do the trick.

Iceman01
07-18-2003, 02:59 AM
Thanks Ed. Is there a way to easily determine the compression ratio? The previous owner said something about forged aluminum pistons.

Also, someone on another forum said the Street Hemi grind purple cam was hydraulic. From my limited knowledge, wouldn't that mandate the use of hydraulic lifters and associated cylinder head setup? Again, the previous owner said something about adjustable rocker arms.

Just trying to get a handle on this stuff. Thanks for the help.

Chris
_____________
1971 Plymouth Satellite Sebring Plus
1998 Dodge Ram 1500
2000 Dodge Neon
2004 Chrysler Pacifica

ehostler
07-18-2003, 10:50 AM
Without pulling the heads off, it is impossible to tell the CR.

The MOPAR cam will require the correct hydraulic valve train.

Beeman71
07-19-2003, 03:58 PM
If your interested I have a new in the box

Mopar Performance Purple Shaft Hydraulic cam and lifters part# P4529270 .464 lift.

jdk1949@yahoo.com

dwc43
07-19-2003, 05:37 PM
Actually a whistler will tell you the correct compression ratio with the engine intact and ready to run. The Hemi grind will be a good cam to use too. They are hydro's and you can still use your adjustable valve train with them too. Plus, dont forget to change the valve springs to match the cam. This is a must. Too much spring pressure for a real high lift cam cam wipe the lobes off the new lower lift Hemi cam. :D

ehostler
07-19-2003, 05:54 PM
bonk... wrong answer...

There is NO accurate way to determin your compression ratio with out knowing the cc of the combustion chamber, CC of the head gasket, exact bore, exact stroke, how far down the piston is at TDC and how much volume the dome/dishing of the piston is.

Any measurements done through a spark plug hole are inaccurate at best. Measurments at the spark plug hole are only good for PSI measurements.

440barracuda
07-19-2003, 06:02 PM
dont put that purple shaft in!


get a hughes or somting like that. NOT MOPAR. I just got a cam whipped out a hemi grind just like the one you have. everything was correct on valve train, so it wasnt my fault. look into somting else. I am not the only one who has got a bad cam. I know 4 other guys that got bad ones too,

dwc43
07-19-2003, 06:32 PM
Originally posted by ehostler
bonk... wrong answer...

There is NO accurate way to determin your compression ratio with out knowing the cc of the combustion chamber, CC of the head gasket, exact bore, exact stroke, how far down the piston is at TDC and how much volume the dome/dishing of the piston is.

Any measurements done through a spark plug hole are inaccurate at best. Measurments at the spark plug hole are only good for PSI measurements.

Your thinking of the normal old compression tester there E. This is a tool used for inspections at tracks. It is very accurate. Since a simple cam change effects compression this will catch any cheaters you might have around you neck of the woods. Not sure how available these tools are though. :D

Iceman01
07-20-2003, 05:03 AM
Thanks for all the tips guys. My head is spinning from reading MOPAR performance stuff and trying to learn all this the past few days. From what I've gleaned so far, sounds like I have more work to do than changing out the cam. Literally everything needs to be tightly coordinated.

Since the hemi grind is hydraulic, need to ensure I have hydraulic lifters and associated heads setup. The previous owner said something about adjustable rocker arms. Also something about forged aluminum pistons. Now I'm worried about the compression ratio being too high. And a new, correctly-matched intake and carb to replace the Edelbrock and six pack. And how this all will coordinate with the 727/B&M shift kit and converter. And the list goes on and on...

About the only thing I know for sure is that the block came out of a 69 Dodge Polara cop car. Got a ton of receipts, but nothing on the crank so assume it is original (anyone have info on it?). Pistons are TRW forged aluminum (I need to look up the part #s for a better ID). Heads have Milodan oversized stainless steel valves. Not sure about the springs and lifters.

My goal is a driver ratched down a notch closer to a stock hi-po 440. Any tips on where to begin? Input gladly accepted!

NOTE: A friend of mine is the service manager at the local Chrysler dealer. This week I will ask him to refer me to one of the local MOPAR experts for an eyes-on-target opinion.

fat bastard
07-20-2003, 03:31 PM
And you'll also need new and correct style lifters to match what ever cam you decide to run.

dewme5
07-20-2003, 04:08 PM
dwc. a cam change will affect the cranking compression ratio, but it will not affect the mechanical compression ratio.

dwc43
07-20-2003, 05:13 PM
Originally posted by dewme5
dwc. a cam change will affect the cranking compression ratio, but it will not affect the mechanical compression ratio.

Yes, that is correct.:D

#nineteen
07-20-2003, 08:19 PM
go with Scott Brown....he can make a custom grind for any application and knows cams and mosers insode and out...forget old MP cams...they are junk,lol...

www.racemufflers.com

fastmopars .inc
07-20-2003, 09:22 PM
well in my opinion, keep the sixpack. way cool factor of like 11/10, and they work awesome when set up right. i had a 70 runner with 440-6pack and you have never heard anything like those other 4 barrels crackin open. also, my car was extremely streetable. 4080 lbs without me and with 9.5 comp, 2800 stall, 4.10 gears and ported 906 heads with a purple shaft .484, it went 13.20@ 105 mph under my ownership. the 484 makes good power if setup with the right combo and has a very nice idle, and if your taking the cheap route, they are a dime a dozen. i know some people don't feel 200 bucks is worth 8 hp =)

also, i sold that car to a buddy who went 12.7's just by changing to a better fuel system.

you are looking at this the wrong way. forged pistons are awesome, and it doesn't mean they are race only pieces. if it has a big cam and no milling of the heads, 10:1 trw pistons might only yield 9:1 comp.

adjustable rocker arms, another good thing. all you need are the lifters and camshaft and you are on your way (different lengh pushrods maybe?) like i said, the 484 makes good power and has a very decent idle, almost no lope.

i ran a 727 and b&m shiftkit in my runner. no problems in 2 years of abuse.

i also drove this car 3000km roundtrip to british columbia four times and averaged 16 mpg (1300cfm!!!)

no point in trying to make it like a stock 440. why you ask? you just want a nice running car, whats wrong with that.
well, my satellite will fire up and idle all day and never go above 170, runs fine on prem pump gas, idles close to a stocker, still has stock heads and runs mid 11's @ 3500 ft above sea level!!
a custom grind hydraulic roller cam, a considerable amount of timing curve and fuel metering test and tune, and i can hop in and drive that car around all day long and never miss a single beat. the technology in camshafts has come a LONG way in 40 years, and if you are willing to spend the money (stick with my previous comment about purple shafts if your not) and a little bit of time, you can do a lot with a little. if you don't wanna tune that sixpack, sell it and buy a worked demon and intake and still have 1000 dollars left over. your way ahead with this project, don't do anything that you will regret next year as soon as that punk in a camaro kicks your ass.

Iceman01
07-23-2003, 05:19 AM
Great advice -- exactly what I had hoped to elicit from those who've been there and done that! I feel a bit more comfortable now about how I need to approach this. Thanks to all who contributed their thoughts/experiences.

Hope to take the "just brought it home" photos of my 32-year-old survivor this weekend. Will post and link ASAP.

ehostler
07-23-2003, 01:50 PM
If you are wanting to buy a great cam, call Racer Brown. they've been custom fabricating cams for over 35 years. The phone number is in the phone book sticky. You tell them what you have and what you would like to do and they will grind the exact cam for you your application.

This Scott Brown guy is fairly new and has nothing to do with Racer Brown. Only one person (very new to this board) has ever heard of him.