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  #61  
Old 03-12-2004, 08:07 PM
355 racer 355 racer is offline
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Charles, In photo #1pg head, the important water holes matching up from the head / block are all the bottom row, correct? My engine builder has cut the water holes in the side of the block, and the connections are working out great. The gasket has all of the top holes matched up, (block & head), but not all of the bottom holes match. At the end of the gasket, there are holes in the gasket, but not in the block. There are also only two holes in the gasket,along the bottom in 2 places , but 3 holes in the block. I am assuming I would have to add the additional holes in the gasket to match the block. My problem is that the builder wants me to tell him exactly what and where to drill. This puts me 'on the spot', the existing holes along the bottom in the block all measure 3/8" now. Do all of the holes in the bottom row in the block have to have mating holes in the head? or is whats there sufficent? The heads are the W2 race heads, 48deg. The block is the R3 9" deck height. The heads are already assembled and finished. The block oil modifications have been completed. I just need to tell him if any more holes need to be drilled into the block. I think he is starting to get "slightly" annoyed with me. I really need your help 'QUICK'. Harry
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  #62  
Old 03-12-2004, 09:13 PM
sanborn sanborn is offline
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Harry:
The most important water passage holes ARE along the bottom of the block and heads. And, the most iportant of these are the larger holes(3/8"-1/2") water passage holes closest to the exhaust valves.

I don't know which gasket you are using but our FelPro gaskets have all the correct holes(but some need to be enlarged). That should be able to serve as a guide as to where to drill any additional holes. Start with a small pilot hole(3/16") to get the basic location, then enlarge to final size.

Hope this helps! Ring if I can be of additional help.
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  #63  
Old 03-12-2004, 09:37 PM
355 racer 355 racer is offline
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Cool

Thank you, Charles, you may here from me. Harry
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  #64  
Old 03-22-2004, 12:34 PM
355 racer 355 racer is offline
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Unhappy Another week.

Just got off the phone w/ my engine builder. He said "if all goes well, it will be done Thursday or Friday". We were supposed to practice Saturday, I hope it rains!!!. 'the old man'
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  #65  
Old 03-22-2004, 01:57 PM
sanborn sanborn is offline
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Harry, I sincerely hope you have the same problem we had with our iron engine on methanol---Sealed front nose, No Ducting, No Fan Shroud, Slow the Water Pump Down(60% of engine speed), No Oil Cooler----And it still runs only 180 water/200 oil(and that's about 15 degrees too cool).
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  #66  
Old 04-16-2004, 10:18 AM
AVENGER29 AVENGER29 is offline
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Sanborn, maybe a stupid question, looking at the picture of your intake, is the thermostat under adapter or above it, do you fabricate adapter or buy it, if so where?????

Dodge29
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  #67  
Old 04-16-2004, 12:58 PM
mightymouse mightymouse is offline
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We do not utilize any thermostat on race engines. Stewart really stresses the fact that any restrictor or thermostat hampers the ability of the cooling system to function @ 100%. I hope this helps.
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  #68  
Old 04-16-2004, 12:59 PM
mightymouse mightymouse is offline
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Also, I forgot to mention. The spacer you see in the photo is from CV Products in NC. It comes pre drilled and tapped for external water lines.
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  #69  
Old 04-16-2004, 03:23 PM
AVENGER29 AVENGER29 is offline
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Mighty, call CV not sure which one to sell me, does the chevy fit the same as Mopar. what part # ??
thanks

Dodge29
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  #70  
Old 04-16-2004, 07:27 PM
sanborn sanborn is offline
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Avenger, the Mopar and small block GM have the same bolt pattern. I am not close to a CV catalog, if you need the part# just ring.
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  #71  
Old 05-28-2004, 09:09 AM
AVENGER29 AVENGER29 is offline
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Fired first of two brand new engines last nite, second will run tonite. Close with track owner and we have permission to use the track on sunday to test & tune, should be a blast. Will run both cars and make a picnic/barbecue out of it......

Dodge29
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  #72  
Old 05-28-2004, 02:21 PM
I8URACING I8URACING is offline
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Question 3/8 holes?

On the picture of the head there are 2 holes, approximately 3/8" along side each head bolt both top (intake) and bottom (exhaust) side. On the attached picture of the block only one of these holes appear to between cylinders 5 and 7. Should the other 3 holes be drilled out? Do we only want the 3/8" holes on the bottom of the block?
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  #73  
Old 05-28-2004, 02:56 PM
AVENGER29 AVENGER29 is offline
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we dont drill the holes at the top of head, nearest lifter valley, but we drill the holes at the bottom, take a good look at head gasket, you will find, not all the holes are there either, we punched them out, go back and re-read Mr. Sanborn notes from page 1 or 2, we also plug, freeze plug both large holes at either end of block nearest left valley, most of the time they are not round but d shape, we drilled them and use freeze plug to plug.
Easy trick if freeze plug is not quite tight enough, use ball pin hammer and pop the freeze plug on steel bench, it will make them swell slightly......

Dodge29
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  #74  
Old 06-07-2005, 03:24 PM
rklaft rklaft is offline
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sanborn, ROCKS,, wow, awsome stuff,,your the man,,thanks,,rklaft44
340 dirt sportman modified,,upstate,ny
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  #75  
Old 06-12-2005, 04:22 PM
dirtmopar44 dirtmopar44 is offline
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Default oval track cooling

great info on cooling. i heve several good blocks but the motor mounts are broken. will have to use motor plate .how should i modify my timming cover?
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  #76  
Old 06-12-2005, 10:55 PM
sanborn sanborn is offline
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We have mounted the front of Mopar SBs three different ways:
1. Using a 1/8" thick steel plate between the block and timing chain cover. The mounts to the frame were solid or could use rubber mounts. The mount point must be close to the block because the 1/8" plate is very flimsy(flexes a lot) if the mount point is more than about 2" from the block. This was the method used to mount the engine in the early "Kit Cars".
2. Using a 1/4"(or thicker) aluminum plate between the water pump and timing chain cover. There are some advantages to this because you can also mount the power steering pump and belt driven fuel pump to the aluminum plate as well. There are disadvantages as well---if you attach the mount to each frame rail, this tends to stiffen the front cross member---and this can be bad on a late model dirt car. OK on pavement---not on dirt.
3. We now use a "saddle" mount with the frame mount points fairly close together---it attaches to the engine with the lower four bolts in the bottom of the timing chain cover. Some spacers are required. This seems to work well for us.
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  #77  
Old 06-13-2005, 08:17 PM
dirtmopar44 dirtmopar44 is offline
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Default cooling system

thank you sanborn for your responce.if i put the .250 plate in between the water pump and timming cover i will have an extra .250 space behind the water pump impeller.I did see your modifiction to the timming cover using a .250 plate. should i make that plate .500? P.S. NICE TO KNOW SOME ONE KNOWS WHAT A KIT CAR IS. I HAVE ONE I AM GOOING TO RESTORE. ONE OF THE SEVERAL PARTS THAT IS MISSING IS THE MOTOR PLATE. WOULD LIKE TO FIND THE KIT CAR BLUEPRINTS. I OWN A STEEL FAB SHOP. EVERY TIME I GO TO THE TRACK WITH MY CAR ,PEOPLE THINK IT CAME FROM PETTY ENTERPRIZES.THE CAR WAS BUILT FROM A CHALLENGER.WILL SEND PHOTO WHEN I CAN.
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  #78  
Old 06-13-2005, 09:15 PM
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Nope just a 1/4 inch to take up the slack that the mount puts there
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  #79  
Old 06-13-2005, 11:54 PM
sanborn sanborn is offline
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dirtmopar44, I prefer to get the clearance between the impeller and the timing cover in the .030"-.060" range. I think this helps to prevent cavitation at high pump RPMs. If that means adding a spacer on the timing cover---so be it!

If you e-mail your shipping address, I will send you the Kit Car Engine Mount. It has been modified but I think I can mark where the mount to the frame should be. If nothing else, it would be a good pattern for your.
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  #80  
Old 06-14-2005, 12:10 AM
dirtmopar44 dirtmopar44 is offline
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Default Cooling System

Thanks Sanborn. If You Send That Kit Car Plate I Will Gladly Send It Back.the Car Has The Mounts Welded To K Frame. Will Use Yours 4 Pattern. Mike Miller Mikes Ironworks Inc 29018 Arrowhead Barstow Ca 92311 Any Body Out There Who Has Any Kit Car Parts Or Info Can Call Me Toll Free 1 888 648 4188 .thanks Mike
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  #81  
Old 06-14-2005, 01:48 AM
racerdave racerdave is offline
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Sanborn, any chance you could give me the part #s to that CV products thermostat housing and spacer with the fittings in it? I am going to try to adapt this same set up to a stock iron manifold. (Rules)
Thanks for all the fine advice.
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  #82  
Old 06-14-2005, 07:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by racerdave
Sanborn, any chance you could give me the part #s to that CV products thermostat housing and spacer with the fittings in it? I am going to try to adapt this same set up to a stock iron manifold. (Rules)
Thanks for all the fine advice.
Check speedway motors. They have the housing and hoses in a kit for like $45 I think.
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  #83  
Old 06-14-2005, 01:36 PM
sanborn sanborn is offline
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Mike, I also have the center engine mount plate---that was used for dirt "Kit Cars". Do you need that as well?

If you plan to use them as patterns only, I will make a paper pattern of each to send to you---or I can send the real thing---your choice.

I don't need them---taking up space in the shop.
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  #84  
Old 06-14-2005, 03:19 PM
AVENGER29 AVENGER29 is offline
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Speedway Motors, has and aluminum engine plate, about 70.00, but it doesnt fit right, will need to re-drill a couple of the bellhousing holes, there off center a little, have complained to Speedway, but they doesnt seem to care.....still a good value for what it is.....

Dodge29
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  #85  
Old 06-14-2005, 06:00 PM
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Summit Racing has a Comp Eng. engine plate for $109 but I have not used one. I did use the big block plate from Comp Eng. for a Duster.
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  #86  
Old 06-14-2005, 09:30 PM
dirtmopar44 dirtmopar44 is offline
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Sanborn . I Will Send You The Money For Shipping If You Send Any Kit Car Items You Want To Part With. Inclose An Envelope When You Ship And I Will Send You Your Shipping Cost Back. Parts,books, Pictures,etc. Thanks Mike
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File Type: jpg Car 44 #3.JPG (39.8 KB, 157 views)
File Type: jpg Car 44 #2.JPG (6.8 KB, 108 views)
File Type: jpg Car 44 #4.JPG (37.1 KB, 107 views)
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  #87  
Old 06-16-2005, 12:17 PM
355 racer 355 racer is offline
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Cool Dirt Mopar 44

You said you have blocks w/ broken motor mounts. If the rear ear is broken, but the two front ears are there, I have a fix for you. we have made a chevy / mopar mount using the 2 front ears , or the 2 top ears. The unit bolts to a standard cheby motor mount bracket as in most late model cars. "The Old Man"
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  #88  
Old 06-16-2005, 02:30 PM
AVENGER29 AVENGER29 is offline
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Hey Mopar44, isnt that rear bumper overkill.....hehehe, looks about the size of a train rail.....

Dodge29
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  #89  
Old 06-16-2005, 10:15 PM
dirtmopar44 dirtmopar44 is offline
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Default cooling system

Thanks for the info 355 racer,but i have decited to go the motor plate way, since my new R block has no factory mounts. Will use the stock blocks for spares.I Will make them fit the motor plate too.Some times I need a bigger rear bumper avenger29 people like to brake check at the track I run. Plus it helps the rear %. Dos not make the car loose with the extra wt past the rear end like you would think.It helped a whole whole lot when I put on the MOPAR KIT CAR LEAF SPRINGS #14& 15. If anybody runs leafs i sugest thay try them. MIKE
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  #90  
Old 06-17-2005, 09:20 AM
AVENGER29 AVENGER29 is offline
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Just teasing.....at some track, may not be a bad idea.....lol

Dodge29
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