Viper V12?

[ram100]

I wanted to post rumor today that I heard form my students that the Viper engine is a V-12 or that they are now producing a v12 engine for the viper. Any truth to it?

[John Kunkel]

The Viper engine is, and always has been a V10.

Your students are probably thinking of Ferrari or Maserati.

[ram100]

Thanks for the reply. I appreciate it. I have seen a concept of a V12 Chrysler with 4 turbos but, I know that it will never be produced. I think they saw this car and thought it was a viper.

[c318cuin]

And except for the turbos and the me 4 12 it is supposed to be in mass production soon.

[ram100]

Good to know. Didn't think the turbos would be all that good ann idea or make it to production like I said. Thanks again.

[wiesshund]

the viper engine is basicaly a V10 version of a lambo V12
maybe thats what your students meant?

thats where the basic design came from, it doesnt exactly resemble a lambo v12 though.

[riquiscott]

Originally posted by wiesshund
the viper engine is basicaly a V10 version of a lambo V12
maybe thats what your students meant?

thats where the basic design came from, it doesnt exactly resemble a lambo v12 though.

I knew that Lamborghini helped design the engine, but I thought the V-10 design was based on a 360 block with two additional cylinders. After all, if it's a V-10 version of a Lamborghini V-12, they sure didn't use anything significant from the V-12, like the four-valve heads, overhead cams, etcetera. Even the bore and stroke philosophy differs wildly between the two engines. The Lamborghini V-12 displaced between 5 and 6 liters, while the Viper V-10 displaced 8 liters, with two fewer cylinders.

Scott Gardner

[wiesshund]

I didnt mean to say that they grabbed the lambo engine and sawed off 2 cylinders.

And no, it doesnt truely compare with a lambo engine.

But that was the starting block when they designed it.
Kind of like "How do we make this for the american market, and have it suit a chrysler muscle car"

[riquiscott]

Originally posted by wiesshund
I didnt mean to say that they grabbed the lambo engine and sawed off 2 cylinders.

And no, it doesnt truely compare with a lambo engine.

But that was the starting block when they designed it.
Kind of like "How do we make this for the american market, and have it suit a chrysler muscle car"

The more I investigate, the more sources I find that say the basis for the Viper engine was the Chrysler LA-series small block, specifically the 360. Both the 360 and the V-10 have a 90-degree "V" configuration, pushrod-operated valves, and two-valve cylinder heads. Also, the V-10 bore and the 360 bore are the same size, and the stroke on the V-10 is only .3" longer than the 360. In comparison, the Lamborghini engine from that time was a 60-degree design, with dual overhead cams and four-valve heads. Several modifcations for the Viper block were a direct result of Lamborghini's input, such as the revised cooling passages and the enclosed lifter valley, but the basic Viper engine is just a 360 Chrysler small block that's been stroked slightly and had two additional cylinders added to it.

Scott Gardner

[Diego SST]

Definately,
Chrysler really got into the sawed off and glued on cylinder theory of engine design in the early 90's. The 3.9 is basically a 318 -2 cylinders and the V-10 is basically a 360 +2cylinders although the V10 and 360 have very little in common when compared to the V6 and 318.

[superdart]

Well, remember, Chrysler did own Lambo in the late 80s to early 90s. I heard Lambo made some of the first 488 V10s FOR Dodge. They way it was explained to me, Lambo was already set up for BIG engines, while at the time the biggest thing Dodge made was the 360. It was a matter of convienence to get the Viper out on time until Dodge got all the tooling set up for the motor.

Then again, the above could all be a load of crap....

[riquiscott]

I've looked around a lot, and I can't find anything concrete as to what Lamborghini's contribution to the Viper V-10 was. I've seen references that they designed the fuel injection, and had some input as to the cooling and oiling systems, but looking at the basic configuration of the Viper engine, (two-valve heads, single camshaft in the block, bore, stroke, etcetera) it's pretty obvious that the basis for the V-10 was a 360 with two additional cylinders. I hadn't heard anything about where the first V-10s were actually produced, but I guess it's possible that Lamborghini started up the production until Dodge could get the tooling up and running.

Superdart - Where in Arlington do you live? I was there from 1984 until 1994, and went to high school there.

Scott Gardner

[superdart]

South of I-20 just off of Collins.

I've lived here since 2000 after getting out of the Army.
I've lived in Texas since being stationed at Ft. Hood in1994.

Small world huh?

[riquiscott]

Originally posted by superdart
South of I-20 just off of Collins.

I've lived here since 2000 after getting out of the Army.
I've lived in Texas since being stationed at Ft. Hood in1994.

Small world huh?

Yep, it is a small world. I lived in Interlochen, in Northwest Arlington. Basically, you take Randol Mill Road all the way West past Fielder, until it dead-ends into a residential area.

I remember when Collins south of I-20 wasn't much more than farmland, but that area has really taken off in the last twenty years. I *still* think of the Parks Mall as being the "new" mall, even though it's been there since 1986 or 1987.

Scott Gardner

[superdart]

Originally posted by riquiscott
Yep, it is a small world. I lived in Interlochen, in Northwest Arlington. Basically, you take Randol Mill Road all the way West past Fielder, until it dead-ends into a residential area.

I remember when Collins south of I-20 wasn't much more than farmland, but that area has really taken off in the last twenty years. I *still* think of the Parks Mall as being the "new" mall, even though it's been there since 1986 or 1987.

Scott Gardner

Actually, there's still a a section off of Bardin that is still farmland.

I have a few friends who live in Interlochen...lucky guy, It's a sweet area. In the last few years they have been building MULTI million dollar homes in there.

And, Parks Mall is still growing like a cancer (two new parking garages, AMC 30 theater,plus a host of new stores) I avoid it like the plague on the weekend....police have to direct traffic.

[Maxwedge]

Chrysler designed the V10 off of the 360. Lambo did the first aluminum blocks(how many chrysler engiens had aluminum blocks before the viper?) Lambo also did the intake(that looks remarkably similar to the lambo piece of that era) they also did tweek the cooling and possibly the oil passages.
A V12 Viper...Never going to happen. A smaller V10 is in our near future...hopefully with better fuel economy and 600hp....
ahh the new hp wars are only for the rich to enjoy...