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  #1  
Old 01-27-2003, 01:51 PM
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tsteiner61 tsteiner61 is offline
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Default Help. It doesn't shift.

Hoping someone can help me get it in gear here.

Just finished putting in the new 4-speed for the Dart. Just one small problem. I can't get it to go into gear. Here's what I know so far.

1. The freeplay at the clutch pedal has been adjusted to approximately 1 inch. It feels right and also I actually had someone else step on it and did a visual under the car and the pressure plate is lifting when the clutch is depressed. Although I am not sure exactly how far it is supposed to move.

2. The trans will go into all gears when the engine is off. Also, it will go into all but R if I lift the rear wheels, although it takes some effort.

3. As soon as I put the wheels down, it becomes physically impossible to get it into any of the forward 4 speeds and when I try to get R it just grinds.

4. The shifter is a Hurst competition plus and was adjusted by putting a nail through the small holes on the throws to line it up for neutral crossover.

I thought maybe still too much freeplay so I tightened it up gradually and kept trying until there was almost no freeplay and still same results as above. So I went the other way and increased the freeplay beyond 1 inch and then I couldn't even get it in gear with the rear wheels up.

Any idea what is wrong here. Any advice on stupid things I should check. This is my first manual.

Oh yeah. The clutch and plate are new from MPP, and the 4-speed has just been rebuilt.
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  #2  
Old 01-27-2003, 04:49 PM
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polarapete polarapete is offline
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Question

Are the clutch parts all from the same car? Was this originally an automatic car and you converted it with donor parts?

What I am getting at is that it is possible that by mixing & matching the linkage parts you may have come up with a combination that does not have enough throw-out bearing travel to disengage the clutch disc and that is why it won't shift.

I would go through the entire system again from the beginning. You probably didn't want to hear that, but, that is sometimes the only lessons that stick with us.

Good Luck
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Old 01-27-2003, 05:50 PM
b-1ken b-1ken is offline
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You seem to be aware that the input shaft is turning even when you depress the clutch pedal. You need to find the reason why. Did you let the transmission hang on the clutch disc while you were installing the transmission? This can bend the disc. If the disc is bent, it will drag even though the pressure plate retracts the proper distance. The question was asked if it was an automatic or a stick car. If it was an automatic, what did you do to get a pilot bushing into the crankshaft? The hole in the back of an automatic crankshaft is only semi-finished. The diameter isn't the correct size AND it is NOT concentric to the centerline of the crankshaft (a least with BB engines). I used to give the crankshaft to my machinist and he bored them to the proper diameter, concentric to the center line (on a milling machine). I know if you banged a pilot bushing into an automatic crank it would bind up the input shaft pilot. Also, did you install an aftermarket scattershield? The pilot hole in the bellhousing (large hole in back of housing which locates the transmission) may not be concentric to the crank centerline. You have to attach a dial indicator to the flywheel and rotate the crank with the indicator checking the runout of the hole. If it is off by more than .010 - .015", you'll need offset dowel pins (in the block) to correct this.
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Old 01-27-2003, 06:06 PM
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tsteiner61 tsteiner61 is offline
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The crankshaft is a new 4" stroker. I thought (I hope..) those came premachined for the pilot bearing.

Tonight I plan on measuring the exact distance w/ feeler gauges that the clutch raises off the flywheel. Do you happen to know in what neighborhood that measurement should be???

Thanks for the help so far.
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Old 01-27-2003, 06:18 PM
b-1ken b-1ken is offline
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If you mean, what is the total distance that the pressure plate retracts, i would imagine .090" should be sufficient, but I'm only guessing here. I depends upon the marcel (wavy spring between the clutch facings). Also, new discs can have a little "fuzz" on the surface. Can you see the disc and the pressure plate from underneath? If so, you should be able to see if the pressure plate is retracting enough to clear the disc.
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Old 01-28-2003, 12:14 PM
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Well. Plenty of clearance between pressure plate and clutch disks. Almost 1/8". Anyone know for sure about the pilot bearing and the 4" stroker crank (whether machining is necessary)??
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Old 01-28-2003, 12:36 PM
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polarapete polarapete is offline
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Lightbulb Weird Suggestion

I am going to suggest something that is a little off-the-wall.

I re-read all the posts to you, mine and b-1ken and in particular his first line about the trans input shaft turning even with the clutch depressed.

I suggest that you pull the trans and bell housing, remove the pressure plate and clutch disc and then reassemble without the clutch parts. This is the only way I know that you could prove or disprove that the trans input shaft is being driven by an unfortunate stack-up of clearances. You should be able to reach into the bellhousing area and turn the input shaft by hand when the trans is in neutral and the engine is off. If you cannot do that, then it may be that the crank hub is not bored deep enough to accept the nose of the trans input shaft as it passes through the pilot bearing or your transmission builder may have shimmed the trans incorrectly.

Good Luck.
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Old 01-28-2003, 05:42 PM
The Beekeeper The Beekeeper is offline
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Another opossibility would be that the clutch disc was installed in the wrong direction with the spring side against the flywheel.....I know this because I did it on my 1st clutch job.....I had a 50-50 chance of getting it right....DOH!!!!!.....Another lesson learned the HARD way.....Tom.
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Old 01-28-2003, 07:07 PM
John Kunkel John Kunkel is offline
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Was the bellhousing dialed to the block? If not, major misalignment could cause the input shaft pilot to bind in the crankshaft pilot bushing.
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Old 01-29-2003, 11:03 AM
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Again my stupidity. Used the wrong clutch cover bolts which caused the edge of the clutch to bind with the cover. I thought socket head bolts would work, but they didn't have enough clearance. Hopefully this is the only problem. Looks like The Beekeeper isn't the only one who learns the hard way.

The bellhousing was dialed in, so hopefully once I get the correct bolts I'll be off and running. Thanks for all the ideas.
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  #11  
Old 01-29-2003, 06:59 PM
The Beekeeper The Beekeeper is offline
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I'm glad it was an inexpensive fix even though you had to pull it down again.......
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