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  #31  
Old 08-30-2007, 02:14 AM
Tarrbabe Tarrbabe is offline
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Default I have always liked the idea of turbo power........

but I can see the problem of having the turbo under the car where cold rainwater can crack the extremely hot metal of the turbo. As I see it, there has to be some lag, just because of the mass involved but the EXPERTS have been working on this for years. The early turbos had a lot of lag but now changes have been made to reduce the problem. That is great.
The power advantage goes un-spoken, but I like the idea that a turbo produces power at a smoother rate than NOS. Instead of just jumping on the rotating mass in an instant, turbo power comes on smooth and don't abuse the bottom end as much as the NOS. Of course, for a street engine, this is a big plus as your engine should last much longer, if you have it set up correctly.
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  #32  
Old 09-16-2007, 12:29 AM
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TrashedCharger TrashedCharger is offline
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I'm not advocating a rear mounted system over a standard system, but hang with me on this one...

Out of curiousity, I'm wondering if creating some sort of heat/ exhaust shield would/ could prevent the turbo from exposed elements. I'm wondering if you used a larger diameter exhaust tube, to run your exhaust through as a heat shield, if that would help the temperature to sustain higher levels.

Basically, what I'm getting at is that if you could somehow fabricate an enclosure for the exhaust pipes going to the turbo, it could increase exhaust pressure to the turbo. And if you were to make a shield for it that mounted to this exhaust tube shield, it would prevent any elements or air wash over the turbo, to retain it's heat. I think it would be interesting to try, just for the sake of science and lab.

It wouldn't be difficult to make an exhaust shield that also housed the turbo from the elements and controlled the temperature more. Heat shields do as much retaining of heat as they do prevent it from escaping and transferring to the rest of the car. I kind of like the idea of having a guard for the exhaust system. It would be as easy as using a few sections of 1/2 larger diameter tubing to surround your pipe. You could even neck it down in spots to weld it directly to the pipe at each end, so it wouldn't rattle.

I wouldn't compare this kind of system to a bonified turbo system, but it may work nicely for someone looking to keep their vehicle's engine bay clutter free.

One thing that I don't quite understand is why they use a motor for oil return. If you have oil pressure, you have oil pressure. You can't compress fluid, unlike a gas, so pressure will sustain infinately in any length of housing/ tubing. Me thinks that they may use the motor to prime the system.

I think it would be interesting to make this system more efficient and practical for use with the aid of heat/ element shields. You could also use inline finned tubing to aid in cooling on the intake tube side.

Any amount of volume on the intake side of a turbocharged system is going to drop your pressure, no matter if it's an intercooler or a long tube. The colder your air gets, the more pressure it loses as well, which is unfortunate, because that makes bigger intercoolers less pressure efficient. However, we can't simply dump hot air into our engines and our engines make more power with cold air, because that cold air can and does expand through the engine somewhat, increasing compression, aside from it's benefits in cooling properties.

I want to see one of these systems enclosed to see how it would benefit practical use and sustain better heat transfer. I would turbocharge my car, except that I don't like the idea of having two turbos in my engine bay. One is hot enough, not to mention the plumbing/ real estate that it takes up.

I don't know, guys, I'm kind of liking this idea if I could get it to work on a street car and sustain more heat transfer. That seems like an easy fix to me. There is plenty of room under there for it.
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  #33  
Old 09-16-2007, 01:53 AM
Tarrbabe Tarrbabe is offline
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Lightbulb I'm not a turbo guru..........

but as I understand it, the reason for using the pump on oiling system is allow for oil pressure on start-up but mostly to keep the system running for a little extra time so the oil don't "coke" when the system shuts off and the oil cooks as it just sits there with the extra heat, which shortens the turbo life spand.
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  #34  
Old 09-16-2007, 09:20 AM
turbododge turbododge is offline
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Turbos are gravity return, just like the rest of the engine bearings, there is no pressure to return the oil.

Be sure to calculate how much all these parts are going to grow with the temp increase, over their length. You need to make allowances for the movement, or things will break.
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  #35  
Old 03-10-2010, 03:17 PM
mccarthy_21 mccarthy_21 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbododge View Post
Yes the pipe is full of exhaust, and gas in, gas out happens at the same rate WHEN IT IS STEADY STATE, as soon as you increase the load, the exhaust pressure goes up as it generates energy to spin the turbo. If you have a big long tube full of low pressure exhaust, you have to add a bunch of extra exhaust to it to allow for the compression of gas in the big tube. It takes a lot more to fill that void in a long tube (big volume) than in a short tube (low volume). Another part of it is that all that exhaust in the tube has mass, so that when you increase the flow as you increase load, you need to accellerate that mass. More mass takes more energy and more time to accellerate, and thus slower spooling.

If you read what I said the first time, I agree that the turbo output to the engine tube in rear mount does work like an intercooler. What I also said was that the turbo inlet (exhaust) tube also gets cooled the same way, and any heat you lose from the exhaust is heat you don't have to build pressure, and thus spool slower.

You can throw personal insults all you want, I built my system the way I wanted, based on sound physics and thermodynamics. But before you start trying to explain physics (chemistry??), to all of us, you better go back to school to learn how it really works.
Turbos function primarily on exhaust heat from the engine, so any heat gained or lost will affect how the turbo reacts. The more heat the turbo has the better it will operate. The rear mount turbo will work, but the heat lost from the exhaust to the rear of vehicle will cause it to be less efficient than a normal turbocharger system with intercooler. Boost is not the only factor to look at when deciding on how to build a system. For example an engine that flows bad but builds 12psi of boost may produce 400hp, but the same engine that flows better with 6psi of boost can produce 50-100 more hp. The key is to match the flow of the engine to flowing capabilities to the turbo or turbos.
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  #36  
Old 10-13-2010, 04:24 AM
sleeper sleeper is offline
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Default Twin Turbo 440 Magnum Smallblock

I have been a previous member several years back, but forgot my old name and password so I am starting over today. I have finally finished it. Here is the build list and I can provide pictures and links once they will let me post them.

440 Magnum Small Block
Speed-O-Motive 5.2 Magnum UMBR Block, 4.185 bore
Darton Sleeves with below the deck reinforcement
Hard Fill of block to just below freeze plugs
Mopar Performance Preminum Steel Crank, 4" stroke
Crower Billet Rods, Ross Forged Turbo Pistons, Lowered top ring & thermal coated, 9:4-1. Zero Gap Rings
Shady Dell HYD Roller Cam 290-286(240-236@.050) .604-.608, 112 Deg LS, installed at 108
ARP Main & Head Studs

Cylinder Heads:
Indy 360-2 230cc runners, CNC program Porting.
Larger Valves and additional porting by Shady Dell Speed Shop
2.150-1.625, 324-248 cfm @.600
T & D Roller Rockers 1.6

Indy 360-2 4-B intake manifold by Shady Dell, 375 cfm
Milodon Fixed Idler Gear Drive
Milodon 4 x 4 Oil pan(9qt), windage tray
Mopar Performance SFI Balancer

2-Turbonetics T60-1 Stage 5 Turbo’s (.58 a/r), 4" inlet, 2.5" Outlet & 3" downpipe with Water Cooled Housings.
2- Turbonetics Evolution Wastegates
1-Turbonetics Godzilla Blow-Off valve
PWR 1500 cfm 3-row air/air intercooler

F.A.S.T. Classic EFI
J & S Electronics Indivdual Cylinder Knock Controller
MSD 6-BTM & Blaster Coil
Gizzmo Multi Scramble Boost Controller

F.A.S.T. 1600 cfm 4-barrel throttle Body
Aeromotive A1000 600lb phr in tank pump
Holley High Flow injector rails, Aeromotive adjustable regulator w/1:1 ratio
120 lb injectors, 2-Bar Map Sensor.

Silver State Motorsports Stainless Turbo Manifolds, 1.75" primary tubes with 2.5" outlet to turbos.
Dr. Gas dual 3" into 5" merge collector
Random Technologies 5" high flow Cat Converter,
Aeorturbine 5" Muffler, Full 5" Mandrel Diesel exhaust system & 6" Exhaust tip.

46RE w/48RE internals
Sonax Billet Input Shaft, Billet Steel Front/High Drum
6-pinion steel planetaries, front, middle & overdrive
Quick Ramp 10 vane pump, Diesel overdrive assembly
A & A Competition Valve Body
Radiator sized cooler and BD Remote cooler with fan, remote filter.

TCS Custom Torque Converter
Cadillac Northstar/Dodge Hybrid
Northstar 11" Billet case, pump & angle milled billet turbine.
Billet Clutch,Woven Carbon Disc with 60% more apply area,2600 stall

NV242 AMG (Hummer H1) that has been modified for the Ram. It has 4 wd low, 4 wd high, 2 wd(for the dyno), Full Time 4 wd for street fun.
Novak Conversions Shifter.

Dodge Hydroboost, Stainless Steel Brakes 80 mm Big Bore Front Kit, Stainless Steel Brakes Big Bore Rear Disc’s.
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