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  #1  
Old 04-25-2003, 11:05 AM
DEPete DEPete is offline
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Default V-10 vs. Diesel

I need a truck for weekend farm work and to pull a 6x12 enclosed trailer a couple of times a month. It will not be my everyday commuter.

I was looking for a diesel 4x4, but now I'm thinking maybe a V-10. What are the benefits to each? They seem to have similar torque ratings, with the V-10 at slightly higher RPMs.

For what its worth, I like to cruise @75MPH with the trailer. I have a V-8 now, and just don't like the way it pulls.
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  #2  
Old 04-25-2003, 01:03 PM
gthomas gthomas is offline
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Using my experience with my V10, if you drive around 75mph, you'll probably get around 10 to 11mpg. I'm sure you'll get 30% to 50% more mpg with the diesel. Based on what I've read, the new diesel has much more torque than the V10 so if you're towing heavy weight and climbing big hills, the diesel should pull them better w/better fuel economy.

On the other hand, I've owned a diesel and I didn't care for the smell and the EXTRA maintenance the diesel requires. And at times finding diesel fuel can be interesting and cause a lot of "pucker" factor.

I would say you can easily get 200k miles out of the V10 and according to owners of the diesel, you'll get considerably more. The initial cost of the diesel can be the main decision maker in all this.

I go to Montana quite a lot and pull some major hills on the way. One of them is probably 20 miles long (Hwy 15 from Victorville CA to Las Vegas NV) and pretty steep at times. The V10 will pull my 10,000 pound 5th wheel up the steepest part of this hill at around 50mph even when its 90 to 100 degrees out without any problems.

Diesel is aound 1.59 out here and the premium gas I use while towing is still around 2.25. This may help my decision when I get a new truck in a couple of years.
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  #3  
Old 04-25-2003, 02:11 PM
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ram100 ram100 is offline
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Do a search on this as well! This topic has been picked over many a time on this board.

Good info gthomas. Positives and negatives to either engine.
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  #4  
Old 04-25-2003, 09:54 PM
fox fox is offline
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I had a diesel then the V-10, and now back to a diesel. All Dodges and I don't ever want a stinking gas motor again.
I don't understand what the extra maintenance is with the diesel?
Change a fuel filter once a year or so?
Also, It doesn't sound like you drive enough to justify a diesel.
I bet that changes once you own one!
Find a good used one-they are out there- check it over well.
If you are looking at the dodge/Cummins, most of these will go 500,000 miles if the filters are changed and good oil is used.
If you buy a used Dodge with the auto trans,be prepared to put a trans in it and don't just trust a trans shop.
There are some good modifications that can be done to the dodge trans that will make it VERY reliable. Shop around and ask here.
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  #5  
Old 04-25-2003, 11:21 PM
99RAMJAMMN 99RAMJAMMN is offline
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Go with the diesel if you plan on towing. They maintain
their fuel economy much better than the V-10 will under
same towing conditions.
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  #6  
Old 04-26-2003, 08:55 AM
davefr davefr is offline
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Go with the V10. For occasional driving, It'll be an extremely long time before you recover the $5-6K diesel engine price premium in fuel savings.

The V10 feels more "spirited", it's quieter, and fuel is easier to find.
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  #7  
Old 04-26-2003, 09:23 AM
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ram100 ram100 is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by davefr
Go with the V10. For occasional driving, It'll be an extremely long time before you recover the $5-6K diesel engine price premium in fuel savings.

The V10 feels more "spirited", it's quieter, and fuel is easier to find.

LOL. That is where people make the mistake. That isn't true. When you go to sell or trade, the diesel engine retains most of it's value even at higher mileage. The V-10 does not and so that fuel savings comes a lot quicker than you think.

Here is a test for those who don't believe me. Go to KBB or some other website and mark up a 2500 truck everything being the same, including mileage, but the engines. First do a V-10 and then do a diesel. You will see that the diesel fetches a much higer value. Talking 2-4 thousand more depending on mileage. I didn't believe it until I tried it........ You pay more up front but you also get a big chunk of it back if you play it right.


However, I think he should use the V-10 since it won't be driven all the time.
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Old 04-26-2003, 11:02 AM
99RAMJAMMN 99RAMJAMMN is offline
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RAM100--I agree. Not only those things you mentioned.
But you can find a basic model diesel (fairly well equiped,
but not a SLT) for $25 to $27K. The price is not much more
than a better equiped V10 model. If you go with a one
owner used diesel you could save a couple of grand more
and still have a low mileage diesel truck that will last a
long time.
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  #9  
Old 04-26-2003, 10:38 PM
davefr davefr is offline
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I just plugged in the numbers. The diesel depreciates at the same rate as the rest of the truck. In my case the truck depreciated 50% with a V10 and 50% with a diesel.

OK, the diesel resale is higher by $2500 but the initial coat was $5000 higher.

That $2500 difference pays for a hell of a lot of gas.

Quote:
Originally posted by ram100



LOL. That is where people make the mistake. That isn't true. When you go to sell or trade, the diesel engine retains most of it's value even at higher mileage. The V-10 does not and so that fuel savings comes a lot quicker than you think.

Here is a test for those who don't believe me. Go to KBB or some other website and mark up a 2500 truck everything being the same, including mileage, but the engines. First do a V-10 and then do a diesel. You will see that the diesel fetches a much higer value. Talking 2-4 thousand more depending on mileage. I didn't believe it until I tried it........ You pay more up front but you also get a big chunk of it back if you play it right.


However, I think he should use the V-10 since it won't be driven all the time.
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  #10  
Old 04-27-2003, 12:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by davefr
I just plugged in the numbers. The diesel depreciates at the same rate as the rest of the truck. In my case the truck depreciated 50% with a V10 and 50% with a diesel.

OK, the diesel resale is higher by $2500 but the initial coat was $5000 higher.

That $2500 difference pays for a hell of a lot of gas.


Well you see the point though. Someone driving and hauling lots of miles would make out well with a diesel. I myself have already passed the $2500 in fuel costs for my truck and its a gas engine. I've only had my truck 3 years I'm already losing to a diesel.

One more thing to consider fuel-wise. Here diesel is the same as 87 octane gasoline. My friends truck goes almost twice as long as mine does on a tank. I'm filling up twice as much as him......... I think it's worth the extra up front. It lasts longer, gets better MPG, has plenty of pulling power, and gives you back a decent chunk when you sell it.

But like I said, If he's not gonna use it all the time, Then put the extra $600 down and get the V-10. It would make more sense in this case.....
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  #11  
Old 04-27-2003, 12:26 AM
J-BODY J-BODY is offline
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I use our truck like the family station wagon. My wife drives it to work and for around town duties. She just put 490 miles on it before I had to fill it. 15.5 mpg city driving in a BIG pickup. I like my diesel

Last year I borrowed my boss's 01 2wd 3.55 geared v-10 truck to pull my race trailer to Phoenix. It pulled like a dream, but I used a whole tank of gas to get there. Three days after taking delivery of our "new to us" 01 4x4 CTD I passed that same exit in Phoenix where I had to stop for gas last year. I still had 1/2 tank in the diesel, and made it to Tucson on one tank. I like my diesel.

I bought used and it took nearly four years of patient waiting for the right truck to come in. I'm looking forward to driving this thing through at least a couple of paint jobs and re-upholster at least once.
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  #12  
Old 04-29-2003, 09:01 PM
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NewBlackDak NewBlackDak is offline
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Don't understand the extra maintenance? How bout the 29qt oil changes? Replacing the fuel filter twice a year if you put any miles on it. I'm sure there are other things too.
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  #13  
Old 04-29-2003, 10:41 PM
macie macie is offline
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Thumbs down V-10

V10's can go boom. # 7 cylinder melt down. Check out Ram v10.com At least 10 blown engines. I have a 10 and Love it, but my next one will be a diesel.
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  #14  
Old 04-29-2003, 11:21 PM
fox fox is offline
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ANYONE who puts 29 quarts of oil in a Dodge/Cummins is going to be buying a motor!!!!!!!

They require 11 quarts. At intervals of 5,000 to 7,000 miles.
Fuel filters should be changed at 12,000 to 25,000. I can change mine in less than 5 minutes.
The motor will go farther than most can get the chassis to go.
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  #15  
Old 04-30-2003, 03:16 AM
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NewBlackDak NewBlackDak is offline
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The 29qts was an exaggeration, cause I didn't really know what it was
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Old 04-30-2003, 05:49 AM
blownoffroadste blownoffroadste is offline
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Question oil change

Quote:
Originally posted by fox
ANYONE who puts 29 quarts of oil in a Dodge/Cummins is going to be buying a motor!!!!!!!

They require 11 quarts. At intervals of 5,000 to 7,000 miles.
Fuel filters should be changed at 12,000 to 25,000. I can change mine in less than 5 minutes.
The motor will go farther than most can get the chassis to go.
correct me if i'm ,but aren't the new cummins rated at 15k mile oil changes?
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Old 04-30-2003, 05:53 AM
blownoffroadste blownoffroadste is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by ram100



Well you see the point though. Someone driving and hauling lots of miles would make out well with a diesel. I myself have already passed the $2500 in fuel costs for my truck and its a gas engine. I've only had my truck 3 years I'm already losing to a diesel.

One more thing to consider fuel-wise. Here diesel is the same as 87 octane gasoline. My friends truck goes almost twice as long as mine does on a tank. I'm filling up twice as much as him......... I think it's worth the extra up front. It lasts longer, ets better MPG, has plenty of pulling power, and gives you back a decent chunk when you sell it.

But like I said, If he's not gonna use it all the time, Then put the extra $600 down and get the V-10. It would make more sense in this case.....
funny how one state over from me the diesel is same as reg unleaded but here it's more than premium - i went to md a couple weeks ago checking prices on diesel all the way there- was more than 93- the 5 k$ outlay over gas i
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Old 04-30-2003, 05:55 AM
blownoffroadste blownoffroadste is offline
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the $5k oulay up front for the diesel doesn't bother me as much as paying more for it than premium- "got to have one reason for the wife why to buy-haha"
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  #19  
Old 04-30-2003, 08:23 AM
fox fox is offline
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The new 03 diesels may be rated for 15,000 mile oilchanges, I'm not sure. They do run cleaner and have less soot.

I don't really consider the clatter as a noise! To me it is music and is better than most of the noise on the radio!!!
I use to own Chevy's and changed 25 years ago.
It is hard to not feel I MUST trade it every 2-3 years!
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  #20  
Old 04-30-2003, 09:07 PM
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Yes diesels go 15,000 now.

Nothing funny about the price here. In fact the prices were darn right scary for a while! Some places are still high for diesel ($1.75- $1.89- near premium prices) but right near where I live, at Betty Beavers Fuel, 87 is $1.55 and diesel is a $1.56. Can't beat that. Down the road 87 $1.57 and diesel also $1.57. Next one up for them is 89 octane both at $1.67.

Now gas near where I work in Albany is around $1.68 for 87 and diesel is $1.70. Guess it depends on where you live. Prices have fallen considerably in NY in the last few weeks.

Guess you gotta live in the right place to have a diesel truck.
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Old 05-01-2003, 07:26 AM
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I live in Virginia west of D.C. In D.C. 87 will still run you close to $1.72, but in my neck of the woods its $1.39. Diesel is still right up there with premium. I'd be curious to know why diesel prices fluctuate differently from gasoline. Sometimes it moves up and down near the price of 93 and other times it hovers around 87. My best guess would be differences in state taxation, and refinery production. Any other ideas?
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Old 05-01-2003, 09:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by jarndt
I live in Virginia west of D.C. In D.C. 87 will still run you close to $1.72, but in my neck of the woods its $1.39. Diesel is still right up there with premium. I'd be curious to know why diesel prices fluctuate differently from gasoline. Sometimes it moves up and down near the price of 93 and other times it hovers around 87. My best guess would be differences in state taxation, and refinery production. Any other ideas?

I owned a '98 diesel and loved it. Then I moved WAY south and didn't need the 4X4 any more, nor did I pull the 5th wheel any more. When you live in a resort area, don't need to travel to one! Anyway, during the five plus years I bought diesel, I noticed it was usually higher in the winter, especially when it was a severe one. Why? Diesel, kerosene and home heating oil are very similar products. When heating oil demand is high, diesel prices go up along with the heating oil price. Down here in the Keys, diesel price is generally the same as 89 octane. Of course there are always gougers who price it at or higher than 93. Like anything else, you gotta shop around.
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  #23  
Old 05-01-2003, 10:34 AM
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Default 15,000K??????

Wow 15,000k .. someone should tell Dodge..LOL..

My 03 250HP auto truck goes 6000KM.. or about 3500 miles between oil changes as recommended by cummins.. and yes the deisel costs more for oil changes.. Mine done at the dealer are about $70Cnd. but the fuel filter is the costly point.. $65cnd.. and I change my fuel filter even 2nd oil change.. Dodge has a problem with their water sensor in the fuel filter. I know 2 guys who have had to buy new injector pumps on the 02s due to dodge not covering it.. they will cover the sensor but not the pump on warranty.

I bought the deisel for the wife to drive as a glorified station wagon and the only thing I don't like are the $1000/month payments// love the torque and the fuel economy..22mpg and only 10,000miles on it so far.. still not broke in and that's also on winter deisel..

I can't wait until the warranty is up so I can do my own oil changes(and lift it for 37s).. Dodge in Canada is a real bitch to deal(for warranty) with so all my maintainance is done at a dealership for now..

Blygy
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  #24  
Old 05-02-2003, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by NewBlackDak
Don't understand the extra maintenance? How bout the 29qt oil changes? Replacing the fuel filter twice a year if you put any miles on it. I'm sure there are other things too.
No spark plugs, nor wires, or the sensors that go along with it either.

No emission inspection here either.

If you tow any amount of weight, once you go diesel you'll NEVER go back to a gasser.
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